Caper11
Active VIP Member
I like trackspeed. Clutching sleds is fun.
850 turbo 165 (stock clutch) vs Xpert 165 (iBackshift)
- Thread starter Dynamo^Joe
- Start date
fredw
Active VIP Member
Before clutching.. you need to have a calibrated skid/ correct attack angle to snow, To its best efficiencies, before I would look at clutching, if your using a third of the track, and trenching fighting the skid, that's not efficient, fix that before fine tuneing clutching.. your load and clutching requirements will be totally different I feel in the new turbo sled after
All you have to do the the turbo doo clutching is make sure it revs at 7900 RPMS that`s peak HP. as long as you don`t have belt slippage there is no way to improve it. it`s all about balance, there are many ways to skin a cat. back in the early 90`s the debate was heavy weights shallow helix or light weights and steep helix, all big big boys like PSI, Hopper, culter, and others say light weights and steep helix with light spring pressures is more efficient, less weight in clutch and on crank, less rotating weight, all the helix degrees are different from ski doo to Polaris to cat, a 40 degrees ski doo helix is not the same as a 40 degree helix from Polaris, as long as the sled revs to 7900 RPMS it does not matter how you make it get there. whether you go heavy weights and shallow helix or light weights and steep helix as long as you have good back shifting. 7900 is 7900 peak HP no matter how you slice it. as far as gearing you go to where you ride, and go to a hill mark your clutch, start at the bottom and pin it, at the top of the hill look at the mark on your clutch and their should be about 1/2 to 3/8 of an inch of mark on your clutch. then you know you are geared right. any more then that and you need to gear down.
snopro
Active VIP Member
There is some thoughts now that you will get better belt efficiency if you have the belt where both ends are the same place on the clutch instead of a tight turn on the secondary and a larger turn on the primary? Thoughts?
Yes that`s a 1 to 1 ratio.
you want your belt about 1/2 inch from the top of your primary clutch, any more then that and you will be in overdrive, with the belt lower in the secondary.
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snopro
Active VIP Member
Of course but whats your thoughts on that theory?
The closer to 1 to 1 the better.
powpowpowpow
Active VIP Member
Like rich's vids over the years, but his comment that skidoo engineers know more than a back yard shop selling clutch kits is laughable. Doo has constantly changed the set-ups from the 17 G4 till present. They have had to put fins on secondary and primary, change motormount, shim motor mount, develop new belt, new belt guard and additional venting, change the belt guard attachment point so belt does not catch, add a belt TEMPERATURE alarm. All this to help with scorching clutch temps and pulling strings.
Yet after all these changes the clutchs still run hotter than the poo or cat. Yes BRP clutch department are genius.
Yet after all these changes the clutchs still run hotter than the poo or cat. Yes BRP clutch department are genius.
<<< but his comment that skidoo engineers know more than a back yard shop selling clutch kits is laughable. >>>
Rich`s comment is spot on, anyone that thinks a guy with a shop in his back yard knows more then the Ski Doo engineers is laughable,
if they were so knowledgeable they would be working for Ski Doo,
<<< Yet after all these changes the clutches still run hotter than the poo or cat. >>> that is a false statement, my clutches DO NOT run hotter then Cat or Polaris
many people did not have problems with belts, yes some did but not all, your one of those people that think a manufacture should come out with the perfect sled in the first year. it`s called R&D and testing, getting it out to the public to find the weak spots and address them which Ski Doo has done and does every year.
Polaris and Cat and Ski Doo all have their problems. Rich`s records stand for themselves, the only records these guys with backyard shops have are the ones you play on the old record players.
Rich`s comment is spot on, anyone that thinks a guy with a shop in his back yard knows more then the Ski Doo engineers is laughable,
if they were so knowledgeable they would be working for Ski Doo,
<<< Yet after all these changes the clutches still run hotter than the poo or cat. >>> that is a false statement, my clutches DO NOT run hotter then Cat or Polaris
many people did not have problems with belts, yes some did but not all, your one of those people that think a manufacture should come out with the perfect sled in the first year. it`s called R&D and testing, getting it out to the public to find the weak spots and address them which Ski Doo has done and does every year.
Polaris and Cat and Ski Doo all have their problems. Rich`s records stand for themselves, the only records these guys with backyard shops have are the ones you play on the old record players.
Caper11
Active VIP Member
1:1 will give you approximately 62mph calculated speed with 2.52:1 gearing, with 3.5” pitch 6t drivers, at 7900 rpm.
Get into overdrive and your mph will increase at the same rpm.
powpowpowpow
Active VIP Member
zx/revs..long time ago but hot clutch and belts
Back on my 09 xp, first 1000 miles 3 belts, scorching clutchs..Put a tied on with some primary changes. no more blown belts but still hot clutchs.
xm same thing, left it stock and blow a belt/pull string every 500 miles hot hot hot.
g4..belts and hot clutchs, put a qrs floater and SHR flyweights, this really reduced heat but still hard to hold hand on for 4-5 seconds, clutch faces were nice and clean though. Get about 1000 miles out of a belt.
Poo GEARED down and a BIT of clutch work, whole other world(1300 miles and belt looks great). Compare to g4 i ride with the g4 scalding, poo mild heat could hardly warm up hand. G4 rider is like what the f%%%. he did 3 belts in 800 miles stock clutching.
No breaks to stop and open side panel to cool things down with my poo!
Back on my 09 xp, first 1000 miles 3 belts, scorching clutchs..Put a tied on with some primary changes. no more blown belts but still hot clutchs.
xm same thing, left it stock and blow a belt/pull string every 500 miles hot hot hot.
g4..belts and hot clutchs, put a qrs floater and SHR flyweights, this really reduced heat but still hard to hold hand on for 4-5 seconds, clutch faces were nice and clean though. Get about 1000 miles out of a belt.
Poo GEARED down and a BIT of clutch work, whole other world(1300 miles and belt looks great). Compare to g4 i ride with the g4 scalding, poo mild heat could hardly warm up hand. G4 rider is like what the f%%%. he did 3 belts in 800 miles stock clutching.
No breaks to stop and open side panel to cool things down with my poo!
Caper11
Active VIP Member
09 xp was a clutching disaster, a “backyard”clutch kits greatly improved that sled.
The secondary setup has been the same since 2012 MY. Do put the black secondary “low elevation” spring in the turbo with the 40deg helix, this year.
Old news there, guys were doing that in 2017.
yes for flatland, not for deep snow climbing a steep hill 1 to 1 is more efficient, less belt slippage, less heat,
yes, because you did not know how to clutch your sled, so the 'backyard' clutch kit worked, if you knew how to clutch your sled you would NOT need a backyard kit to do it for you.
pfi572
Active VIP Member
You’re not showing a whole bunch of expertise in your posts . But you carry on tuner .
And maybe go start your own 1709 tuning thread instead of bashing this one . Thx
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Caper11
Active VIP Member
Bold statement considering. It looks like your a youtube tuner.
As a “backyard” tuner I do not sell kits, but I dont not have a problem setting sleds up, or helping others.
Quit ruining a perfectly good thread that DJ has started.
Start your own explaining the difference between a polaris 40deg and a doo 40 deg helix. We could use the entertainment.
Shredder
Active VIP Member
Be interesting to get a bunch of us together somewhere with all our different clutching. From the guys running backyard kits, to the guys that think they are self taught gurus. I enjoy listening to all the open clutching talk. But prefer to keep a close network of people I choose to share info with. I can drink beer in a hot tub and discuss a random subject all night that I know nothing about with guys that also know nothing about it. The guy that knows the most about the particular subject likely sat there and said very little all night.
powpowpowpow
Active VIP Member
Notice a trend? xp/xm/g4 all hot clutch it is not just the xp. But the xp was bad as the mounts needed to be epoxied to stop from moving and delaminating. Local dealer sells alot of doo belts, poo dealer sells the odd one. Numerous buddies were blowing belts on various doo chassis, they switch to poo and same riding as before suddenly no more blown belts.
I was hoping with the p-drive things would be better, but that is not the case at all. And to have to pull the clutch off for a spring change is flat out stupid.
I was hoping with the p-drive things would be better, but that is not the case at all. And to have to pull the clutch off for a spring change is flat out stupid.
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