My experience with the Tesla Model 3

[doorfx]

Daughter bought a new condo in a huge complex. The entire complex is solar ready. You can sign up for solar for an additional cost and they do the entire grid tied install. Thousands of new homes now come with solar installed. Times, they are a changin.

 

[Stompin Tom]

how big of a solar grid do you need to charge an electric car?

 

[jhurkot]

how big of a solar grid do you need to charge an electric car?

It would be highly dependant on where you live, how much you drive, and the type of EV. In the summer I use 15 kWh/100km ($3) and in the winter 20-25kWh/100km ($4-5).

 

[Pedaling pete]

Times are changing. As electric cars catch on apartments with chargers will be in high demand, and as such the building owners will be able to charge a premium for those apartments. At some point other buildings will be retro-fitted to have chargers put in to increase desirability to tenants.

The electrical grid is already in need of upgrades in many of areas of the continent anyway, it just makes sense at that point to increase capacity to supply electric transportation as well. Even Alberta is changing in this regard, Alberta now has 5 solar farms, and in the last 6 months 2 grid scale batteries have come online with at least 2 more planned for construction in the next year. The batteries and at least 3 of the solar farms were built without taxpayers dollars.

Norway is proving it's possible, in 2020 54% of new vehicles sold there were electric.

Norway also has a 1.2 trillion dollar (200,000$ per person in norway) Sovern wealth fund from the proceeds of thier oil industry.

Mean while in Canada...

 

[LennyR]

Times are changing. As electric cars catch on apartments with chargers will be in high demand, and as such the building owners will be able to charge a premium for those apartments. At some point other buildings will be retro-fitted to have chargers put in to increase desirability to tenants.

The electrical grid is already in need of upgrades in many of areas of the continent anyway, it just makes sense at that point to increase capacity to supply electric transportation as well. Even Alberta is changing in this regard, Alberta now has 5 solar farms, and in the last 6 months 2 grid scale batteries have come online with at least 2 more planned for construction in the next year. The batteries and at least 3 of the solar farms were built without taxpayers dollars.

Norway is proving it's possible, in 2020 54% of new vehicles sold there were electric.

Norway is just a little more than half the size of Alberta, hardly an apt comparison, plus they fully monetize their natural resources, unlike our idealist morons in Canada.

 

[ABMax24]

Norway also has a 1.2 trillion dollar (200,000$ per person in norway) Sovern wealth fund from the proceeds of thier oil industry.

Mean while in Canada...

Norway is just a little more than half the size of Alberta, hardly an apt comparison, plus they fully monetize their natural resources, unlike our idealist morons in Canada.

Sure, both those points are valid. Norway has cheap and abundant hydro electricity, extensive funding within the government coffers to help make the change, huge subsides for EV's, milder climate, shorter distances to travel, the list goes on.

The point I'm trying to make is life doesn't have to stop or be impaired by making the switch to EV's. Canada's adoption will be slower, particularly outside of metro areas, but by 2030 the carbon tax increase is going to make anyone looking at a new vehicle weigh the economics of EV's. I think we will be benefitted by this delay, EV tech is still rapidly advancing, especially the battery tech, hopefully by time EV's become more common place in Canada the technology will be more mature and provide much more competitive products to conventional vehicles.

 

[Pedaling pete]

Sure, both those points are valid. Norway has cheap and abundant hydro electricity, extensive funding within the government coffers to help make the change, huge subsides for EV's, milder climate, shorter distances to travel, the list goes on.

The point I'm trying to make is life doesn't have to stop or be impaired by making the switch to EV's. Canada's adoption will be slower, particularly outside of metro areas, but by 2030 the carbon tax increase is going to make anyone looking at a new vehicle weigh the economics of EV's. I think we will be benefitted by this delay, EV tech is still rapidly advancing, especially the battery tech, hopefully by time EV's become more common place in Canada the technology will be more mature and provide much more competitive products to conventional vehicles.

Definitely, buy what ever works for you. Crippling the oil industry instead of taking advantage of it is suicide for Canada though.

 

[LennyR]

The reality !

 

[ABMax24]

Definitely, buy what ever works for you. Crippling the oil industry instead of taking advantage of it is suicide for Canada though.

I agree, the oil and gas industry is the best way to fund whatever must come next. If the government has any logical sense what so ever natural gas will be around for a long time yet, especially if it used as the feedstock for hydrogen.

But I don't see significant further development in the oilsands, after the cancelling of the Teck mine I don't see another large project ever being proposed up there. The operating mines will continue to operate, and SAGD will continue to be developed on a small scale. Much of this will be driven by pipeline capacity, personally I don't ever see the new Transmountain line moving a drop of oil, Trudeau will cancel the project before completion or will prevent it from operating once complete, and Keystone XL will be cancelled sometime in the next month.

 

[Pedaling pete]

I agree, the oil and gas industry is the best way to fund whatever must come next. If the government has any logical sense what so ever natural gas will be around for a long time yet, especially if it used as the feedstock for hydrogen.

But I don't see significant further development in the oilsands, after the cancelling of the Teck mine I don't see another large project ever being proposed up there. The operating mines will continue to operate, and SAGD will continue to be developed on a small scale. Much of this will be driven by pipeline capacity, personally I don't ever see the new Transmountain line moving a drop of oil, Trudeau will cancel the project before completion or will prevent it from operating once complete, and Keystone XL will be cancelled sometime in the next month.

Canada is going to have no industry at all the way things are going. Everyone will be riding the bus, if they get to leave home ever.

Will the bus be electric or natural gas powered is the real question lol

 

[LennyR]

It would be highly dependant on where you live, how much you drive, and the type of EV. In the summer I use 15 kWh/100km ($3) and in the winter 20-25kWh/100km ($4-5).

How much of those $’s are tax that goes back to road building and maintenance or sustaining our vehicle corridors ? Are there any taxpayer funded subsidies that are artificially keeping the cost of that product there ? How many jobs are created ? How realistic is it to believe our power delivery systems can be upgraded to keep the cost where it’s at to make this a viable choice ?
Not bashing , I think it’s pretty cool, but as in so many “greenie” initiatives , it’s sorta like destroying a whole bunch of Paul’s industries and lively hood to benefit a few Peters.

 

[adamg]

How much of those $’s are tax that goes back to road building and maintenance or sustaining our vehicle corridors ? Are there any taxpayer funded subsidies that are artificially keeping the cost of that product there ? How many jobs are created ? How realistic is it to believe our power delivery systems can be upgraded to keep the cost where it’s at to make this a viable choice ?
Not bashing , I think it’s pretty cool, but as in so many “greenie” initiatives , it’s sorta like destroying a whole bunch of Paul’s industries and lively hood to benefit a few Peters.

All valid questions that need to be reckoned with for EVs to make up a significant portion of the fleet.

 

[52weekbreak]

It would be highly dependant on where you live, how much you drive, and the type of EV. In the summer I use 15 kWh/100km ($3) and in the winter 20-25kWh/100km ($4-5).

Thanks for tis bit of info. that works out to 3 cents per KM in summer and lets say 5 cents in the winter. For comparison, I have an Altima which is very comparable size-wise and driving at 100 K, I can get 6 liters per 100 K if everything is just right but I average 7.5 and at $1 per liter that works out to between 6 and 7 1/2 cent per K.

What is your normal range in the winter? Also your car is now a couple years old so I wonder how much they have been able to extend the range since yours was delivered. Cheers - K

 

[jhurkot]

Thanks for tis bit of info. that works out to 3 cents per KM in summer and lets say 5 cents in the winter. For comparison, I have an Altima which is very comparable size-wise and driving at 100 K, I can get 6 liters per 100 K if everything is just right but I average 7.5 and at $1 per liter that works out to between 6 and 7 1/2 cent per K.

What is your normal range in the winter? Also your car is now a couple years old so I wonder how much they have been able to extend the range since yours was delivered. Cheers - K

Winter is a mixed bag. If it’s -30, headwind, going uphill you’re going to be at the worst of that range. In -10 and light or no wind it can be surprisingly good. My November 2018 build was 499km range new but now is around 475-480km range with degradation. New 2021 model 3 has a range of 570km and might even be a bit cheaper.

I’m at 80,000km and so far maintenance has been wiper blades, washer fluid, and tires. Might do the cabin air filter soon, just been lazy. Also might replace the 12V battery ($110) just as preventative maintenance. When they fail the vehicle is a brick.

 

[doorfx]

Thanks for tis bit of info. that works out to 3 cents per KM in summer and lets say 5 cents in the winter. For comparison, I have an Altima which is very comparable size-wise and driving at 100 K, I can get 6 liters per 100 K if everything is just right but I average 7.5 and at $1 per liter that works out to between 6 and 7 1/2 cent per K.

What is your normal range in the winter? Also your car is now a couple years old so I wonder how much they have been able to extend the range since yours was delivered. Cheers - K

Did you include regular maintenance in your cost per liter calculation?

 

[Cdnfireman]

Winter is a mixed bag. If it’s -30, headwind, going uphill you’re going to be at the worst of that range. In -10 and light or no wind it can be surprisingly good. My November 2018 build was 499km range new but now is around 475-480km range with degradation. New 2021 model 3 has a range of 570km and might even be a bit cheaper.

I’m at 80,000km and so far maintenance has been wiper blades, washer fluid, and tires. Might do the cabin air filter soon, just been lazy. Also might replace the 12V battery ($110) just as preventative maintenance. When they fail the vehicle is a brick.

And as you’ve reported before, those ranges are without using the heater in winter or the A/C in summer, and despite the 499km range you quote, you also report that you have to stop in red deer to recharge on the way to Edmonton. And the manufacturers state that the battery can’t be charged over 80% or discharged below 10% or the battery will be damaged.....so the 499 km stated is actually at best 70% of that as you can never fully charge or discharge the battery. And then unless you happen to find the Tesla super-duper charger empty and functional in red deer, you get to sit there for a couple of hours to charge up the car. Battery EV’s are still a niche automotive fad for the people that can afford them and want to feel good about themselves, but for most people they’re not viable. The technology is cool as hell, and DC tractive power will be the way of the future, but not until they find a better source of mobile electrical power than a battery made of expensive, poisonous and impossible to recycle rare earth materials.

 

[jhurkot]

And as you’ve reported before, those ranges are without using the heater in winter or the A/C in summer, and despite the 499km range you quote, you also report that you have to stop in red deer to recharge on the way to Edmonton. And the manufacturers state that the battery can’t be charged over 80% or discharged below 10% or the battery will be damaged.....so the 499 km stated is actually at best 70% of that as you can never fully charge or discharge the battery. And then unless you happen to find the Tesla super-duper charger empty and functional in red deer, you get to sit there for a couple of hours to charge up the car. Battery EV’s are still a niche automotive fad for the people that can afford them and want to feel good about themselves, but for most people they’re not viable. The technology is cool as hell, and DC tractive power will be the way of the future, but not until they find a better source of mobile electrical power than a battery made of expensive, poisonous and impossible to recycle rare earth materials.

Yeah I stop for 7 minutes in red deer. Plug in, piss, and leave. The trip is about 542km and I like to drive highway 2 at 120-130km with a/c.

Oops maybe 10minutes. Is a ten minute stop on a five hour drive really a deal breaker?

 

[Cdnfireman]

Yeah I stop for 7 minutes in red deer. Plug in, piss, and leave. The trip is about 542km and I like to drive highway 2 at 120-130km with a/c.

Oops maybe 10minutes. Is a ten minute stop on a five hour drive really a deal breaker?

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That’s your story this time.....you’ve said much different before....it changes to fit your narrative

 

[jhurkot]

That’s your story this time.....you’ve said much different before....it changes to fit your narrative

Are you done making up imaginary reasons why I can’t enjoy the electric car I purchased with my own money?

 

[Cdnfireman]

Are you done making up imaginary reasons why I can’t enjoy the electric car I purchased with my own money?

Nothing imaginary about them. I hope you enjoy the hell out of your car, you worked hard to get the money, use it how you want. You sure as $hit don’t need my approval as I’m sure you’ll agree. You’ve convinced yourself that it’s a good idea for you. Just don’t try convince us that it’s a good decision for everyone else, because for 99% of the people that don’t have the extra disposable income for a $60k toy with huge compromises, it’s not.