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[catinthehat]

Maybe my point was mistaken, I am actually more for the smaller clubs, and know they need more support. I belong to a small club of which I have bought a trail fee pass even though no one collected, I did this because I know they had no way to collect and need help. I don't pretend to know the answers at all but I can have an opinion and I know it may not be right, because I don't have all the answers but since grown adults can't talk with out resulting to name calling I will kindly leave the conversation. Have fun ridiculing others who want to help! This might be why lots of people don't belong to clubs. Happy Riding, Dave

First, thank you for paying your way, however, buying a trail pass isn't belonging to a club. The trail pass supports the club locally but those numbers are not reported in any way to help provincial or even local negotiators who have to fight for our rights. When we sit down at these meetings we need all the ammunition possible, the other side is well aware that at either level we represent 10-15 % of snowmobilers. The rest don't belong to any organization, that is a sad fact.
And yes we all have opinions and ideas that others rarely agree with but sometimes solutions come from unexpected sources.

 

[Lund]

Maybe my point was mistaken, I am actually more for the smaller clubs, and know they need more support. I belong to a small club of which I have bought a trail fee pass even though no one collected, I did this because I know they had no way to collect and need help. I don't pretend to know the answers at all but I can have an opinion and I know it may not be right, because I don't have all the answers but since grown adults can't talk with out resulting to name calling I will kindly leave the conversation. Have fun ridiculing others who want to help! This might be why lots of people don't belong to clubs. Happy Riding, Dave

Thank you, common theme on S&M, no opinions allowed

 

[snopro]

Yeah Dave takes the time to try and help the sledding community, trying to offer solutions and find solutions and peeps just bag on him. If you don't agree with his idea's or his attempt at a solution then offer one of your own? Remember if you are going to slag someone that is trying to help you better come up with an answer that the BCSF will see and say holy fawk, write it up and send it to the masses or expect the same back. Something he didn't lower himself to in this thread. This site is degenerating to a bunch of school kids fighting over a seat in a school bus.

 

[Lund]

Yeah Dave takes the time to try and help the sledding community, trying to offer solutions and find solutions and peeps just bag on him. If you don't agree with his idea's or his attempt at a solution then offer one of your own? Remember if you are going to slag someone that is trying to help you better come up with an answer that the BCSF will see and say holy fawk, write it up and send it to the masses or expect the same back. Something he didn't lower himself to in this thread. This site is degenerating to a bunch of school kids fighting over a seat in a school bus.

Caution to anyone trying to do that...

 

[snopro]

Caution to anyone trying to do that...

There are guys that are offering ones and there are guys just slagging anything they don't agree with.

 

[lilduke]

Support your Local snowmobile club. If it isn't broke don't try to fix it.

 

[lewey]

Funny how people pay $150 for a single club membership but want province wide for same price.

 

[tex78]

Funny how people pay $150 for a single club membership but want province wide for same price.

I don't want province wide at all


I don't ride any where else, and to drive 1 hr plus to go somewhere else for lower - less riding the way I like, don't make sense

There's 4 club areas, of which a guy could ride 12 plus days in a row and other than the main trail up, would be different trips every day

Then there's all the other places to go, which could ride a month straight in total

So.........

sent while drinking tea's

 

[pistoncontracting]

When did grown adult men become so soft??

It's very hard to have a passionate conversation, if you refuse to be in the conversation unless everyone agree's with you. I understand some people don't... appreciate the odd 'degrading' comment, but good Lord guys, toughen up, it's not like there is a risk of a fist in the mouth.

In the case of those that offer to leave the conversation- they didn't seem to offer any solutions, except to bow down to the new single pass.

But seriously... .

Maybe we should look at the flip side- what happens when the super new single pass comes out, and the guys that don;t like it claim their feelings are hurt, and 'leave' the sport?? Because that's exactly what happens. There should be no reason for us to forced into paying for each other. If you want to do it voluntarily, fine. If it's a good idea, people will do it voluntarily. And obviously, enough seem to, since there doesn't seem to be much enforcement.

 

[snopro]

I don't know what the answer is but for myself it is to pay to play at the hills I ride at. I ride almost exclusively Revelstoke so I buy a yearly membership there. When that good hearted Ferniesnow invites me to Fernie for sledding and garlic shrimp I buy a day pass for Fernie. I'm fine if it stays the same but if there is a way to get more peeps paying that skip the toll booths then I would be in favor of that. We need to grow this sport and save it from extinction because there are a lot of left leaning leaf lickers trying very hard to make us go away.

 

[Rbrduk]

What about having a pass that makes you a member to the bcsf (at the bcsf $ portion) but not a club member. Then those peeps can pay the daily trail fee or upgrade to a club membership
Don't change anything else. The clubs still get what they get, and the bcsf get more members. I'm lucky if i ride out that way 5 times a year. To spend money on a club membership doesn't work for me because I ride multiple areas in those few times. I would pay an extra $30 a year to belong to the federation to add my voice. I buy a ASA pass because I live in Alberta, but hardly ride the ASA trails. The gate crashers will never go away, which is unfortunate.

 

[LBZ]

If it's not about money why charge at all? Clubs should all have records of how many daily and seasonal passes they sold right? BCSF can get it from the clubs to get a number of people riding and use that as their status support.

If it's about money, then just take a percentage of trail passes and memberships from each club while giving them some sort of incentives to participate in the BCSF somehow either in a monetary kickback or sponsorship/discounts on products that the BCSF may be able to arrange with certain companies or sled manufacturers.

 

[shockman]

This is a bunch of dog****
What's next the Politicians to
And big payed sled organizers

the mountains are free

and suport the clubs that maintain ur sledding areas only

beat it!! Bcsf and Dave

WOW !! wiser words I've never heard!!

 

[MarkCos]

Agree Not will I
humm

 

[skegpro]

http://snoriderswest.com/article/cl...plan_is_the_hottest_topic_in_the_b.c._sled_sc

 

[rightsideup]

If it's not about money why charge at all? Clubs should all have records of how many daily and seasonal passes they sold right? BCSF can get it from the clubs to get a number of people riding and use that as their status support.

If it's about money, then just take a percentage of trail passes and memberships from each club while giving them some sort of incentives to participate in the BCSF somehow either in a monetary kickback or sponsorship/discounts on products that the BCSF may be able to arrange with certain companies or sled manufacturers.

they can if the clubs provide it. How many people access the back-country with out paying and use the club services such as the warm up shelters happens more than you think

 

[Powder Puff]

Whew quite the read. Of course riders from out of province want this, not a lot of riders in BC travel to ride.
The riders who ride unmanaged areas will continue to do that, even when it is the local club fighting to keep those areas open for them to ride. They will continue to not help support, that is just who they are. Maybe the number of those type of riders will increase.
Proposing a $150-$200 PMP is nowhere the price should be. I am thinking more like $500-$600.
Our memberships have increased this season mostly to cover a $7.50 increase to the portion paid to the BCSF and the cost of doing business doesn`t go down ever.. I`m guessing a lot of other clubs had to do the same.
I suggested at the spring meeting that anyone riding in BC purchasing a daily pass must also pay a one time yearly fee of $35 (the new BCSF fee amount) to ride in BC and support the BCSF. Membership and funding for the BCSF would increase significantly.
All of the big clubs voted against the PMP, it was the smaller clubs that pushed the 2nd phase through. In my opinion the ones who will benefit.
What I see happening is again when we vote in the spring the small clubs will out number us again and the PMP will get pushed through. Sadly I think that then you will see the majority of or maybe all of the larger clubs leave the BCSF and they are the ones collecting the majority of the funding for the BCSF through memberships sales.
I don`t know the answer but this one has me scared.
Clubs are leaving now because of the $1700 bill and some are refusing to pay it. How this fair to the clubs who voted against it but have paid.

When you talk snowmobile clubs in the province you aren`t comparing apples to apples.
Donegal and Richard, no disrespect, ever. Looking forward to the meeting in Oct. These next few meetings are sure to be entertaining.
Tough crowd eh Dave?

These are my own personal opinions and in no way reflect upon the Revelstoke Snowmobile Club.

 

[rightsideup]

Whew quite the read. Of course riders from out of province want this, not a lot of riders in BC travel to ride.
The riders who ride unmanaged areas will continue to do that, even when it is the local club fighting to keep those areas open for them to ride. They will continue to not help support, that is just who they are. Maybe the number of those type of riders will increase.
Proposing a $150-$200 PMP is nowhere the price should be. I am thinking more like $500-$600.
Our memberships have increased this season mostly to cover a $7.50 increase to the portion paid to the BCSF and the cost of doing business doesn`t go down ever.. I`m guessing a lot of other clubs had to do the same.
I suggested at the spring meeting that anyone riding in BC purchasing a daily pass must also pay a one time yearly fee of $35 (the new BCSF fee amount) to ride in BC and support the BCSF. Membership and funding for the BCSF would increase significantly.
All of the big clubs voted against the PMP, it was the smaller clubs that pushed the 2nd phase through. In my opinion the ones who will benefit.
What I see happening is again when we vote in the spring the small clubs will out number us again and the PMP will get pushed through. Sadly I think that then you will see the majority of or maybe all of the larger clubs leave the BCSF and they are the ones collecting the majority of the funding for the BCSF through memberships sales.
I don`t know the answer but this one has me scared.
Clubs are leaving now because of the $1700 bill and some are refusing to pay it. How this fair to the clubs who voted against it but have paid.

When you talk snowmobile clubs in the province you aren`t comparing apples to apples.
Donegal and Richard, no disrespect, ever. Looking forward to the meeting in Oct. These next few meetings are sure to be entertaining.
Tough crowd eh Dave?

These are my own personal opinions and in no way reflect upon the Revelstoke Snowmobile Club.

I disagree with you on a few of your points but agree with you on some as well. I ride with a lot of different people and many travel and ride different areas within bc that are from bc. It just is not as prevalent in area's like sicamous, revelstoke and possibly golden. some sledders within bc like myself have at least two seasonal passes so that is a point we disagree on. One point I do agree on is at the spring meeting in valemount we could have come up with some more creative methods of funding the business case.

 

[catinthehat]

Whew quite the read. Of course riders from out of province want this, not a lot of riders in BC travel to ride.
The riders who ride unmanaged areas will continue to do that, even when it is the local club fighting to keep those areas open for them to ride. They will continue to not help support, that is just who they are. Maybe the number of those type of riders will increase.
Proposing a $150-$200 PMP is nowhere the price should be. I am thinking more like $500-$600.
Our memberships have increased this season mostly to cover a $7.50 increase to the portion paid to the BCSF and the cost of doing business doesn`t go down ever.. I`m guessing a lot of other clubs had to do the same.
I suggested at the spring meeting that anyone riding in BC purchasing a daily pass must also pay a one time yearly fee of $35 (the new BCSF fee amount) to ride in BC and support the BCSF. Membership and funding for the BCSF would increase significantly.
All of the big clubs voted against the PMP, it was the smaller clubs that pushed the 2nd phase through. In my opinion the ones who will benefit.
What I see happening is again when we vote in the spring the small clubs will out number us again and the PMP will get pushed through. Sadly I think that then you will see the majority of or maybe all of the larger clubs leave the BCSF and they are the ones collecting the majority of the funding for the BCSF through memberships sales.
I don`t know the answer but this one has me scared.
Clubs are leaving now because of the $1700 bill and some are refusing to pay it. How this fair to the clubs who voted against it but have paid.

When you talk snowmobile clubs in the province you aren`t comparing apples to apples.
Donegal and Richard, no disrespect, ever. Looking forward to the meeting in Oct. These next few meetings are sure to be entertaining.
Tough crowd eh Dave?

These are my own personal opinions and in no way reflect upon the Revelstoke Snowmobile Club.

I agree with most of what you are saying, I belong to two clubs even though I rarely ride in their managed areas.
One club has already left the BCSF as it is a small club that simply could not afford to stay, the other club is exactly as you described, they voted to pursue the PMP mainly because of how much money they stood to gain. ( Even though nobody believes it can be done at the rates proposed.)
I personally will not be paying 100-150 dollars a year over and above club memberships.
There is simply too much area to ride that has no club management and if it comes down to a fee to ride crown land then I guess my sledding days are done.
The BCSF is a valuable organization and we definitely need to find a way to fund them better, but robbing peter to pay paul isn't it.
Perhaps when they were working with Government to bring in mandatory registration they could have worked out a deal where they received a portion of that money.

My viewpoint for what it's worth.

 

[indyxcsp]

no offence taken, ever powder Puff! I have always said I am not convinced the PMP is the future, but as a Businessman, I would like to have the Idea pool of people/professionals flesh out the best possible scenario to see if it is viable.
I would like too see how the clubs will deal with each other in regards to the Bylaws, the $1700 invoice, and the idea of a Federation. THE BCSF Board of Directors are literally dropping like flys in fear of the unknown future. Are we still a relevant govt force if we are dammed if we do and dammed if we don't follow Club/Federation Bylaws. Three Directors who stepped up in Valemount dropped off in 60 days once they saw the LOCKDOWN we are facing. Two more last month once the letters came in from Clubs refusing to stand with the vote.
I have ultimate RESPECT for Revelstoke who adamantly voted against the PMP in all aspects, but paid the invoice in spite, upholding the Bylaws and the Rules of the Federation. No responses of "because they can" is acceptable because nobody likes a $1700.00 invoice.
We are all unsure where this will go, but I hope the division creates engagement from Clubs, and the engagment drives direction, and the direction drives results....
I look forward to October Club Congress as well, I got a flack jacket for the tough crowd.