sidehillgouger
Active member
LOL at stompin tom
Aboriginal protests in Canada.
- Thread starter pfi572
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Stompin Tom
Active VIP Member
Did you have anything intelligent to add to the conversation or are you just a natural born arsehole?
Stompin Tom
Active VIP Member
Never said I had a solution, but I can see there is more than one side to this story.
Here is a little something for you to think about. Every race and creed of people have their "lesser" citizens. You go to the reserves and for the most part you find the natives who dont want to venture into "whitey" world and succeed as we may expect them to. Right or wrong that is their choice. But the natives who do wish to "expand" their horizons leave and work to better themselves in "whitey's" eyes, become more stable in our world and live to our exceptions. Now where does this cross over to? Well, around here we have what we call the "Hood" which is mainly populated by the "lesser" white citizens, those who dont want to get a "real" job, those who prefer drugs and booze over work. Most their collect welfare.
In reality is there much of a difference? The reserve, the hood? I think natives will take offence to this, but what I am trying to say is there are people who live off the government, doesnt matter what race they are.
Stompin Tom
Active VIP Member
great example of a single moment in history, of course upon reading up on the area a bit, I presume you mean Western Thrace, the Turks claim the area was their native land before the Greeks took it from them, they took it back in the early 1900's and were given the rights to stay there by the Treaty of Lausanne. There are 3 sides to every story, your side, my side and what really happened. In this situation it appears your Great Grandparents may have the the equivilent of us "whitey's" and the Turks were the natives but instead of sitting back on reservations they took back what they thought was theirs by means of war. A treaty was signed by all parties involved and has since been abbided by all involved.
deaner
Active VIP Member
The problem with our country is bleeding hearts like stompin tom. Give me a fawking break buddy.
How many civilizations have been taken over by others in human history? Countless. Yes the natives were here before us. We came and took it. And we were the nicest about it it has EVER been done. Has any conquered civilization ever recieved the kind of treatment we are giving our natives? Enough is enough.
But Im sure old tom is going to tell me what an awful person I am so he can go to bed knowing what a wonderful liberated person he is.
How many civilizations have been taken over by others in human history? Countless. Yes the natives were here before us. We came and took it. And we were the nicest about it it has EVER been done. Has any conquered civilization ever recieved the kind of treatment we are giving our natives? Enough is enough.
But Im sure old tom is going to tell me what an awful person I am so he can go to bed knowing what a wonderful liberated person he is.
Toro
Active member
Get a job, pay taxes and vote!!, don't get me started, you have the right to speak/protest, you also have the right to go to jail when you break the law, that includes blocking border crossings!!
Stompin Tom
Active VIP Member
When I was a young pup I used to think like you, we won the war, to the victors go the spoils, yada yada yada. Now that I have more than a few grey hairs on my head and have had the chance to see the other side of the story I have a different point of view. The thing to remember is many of the "wrongs" us "whitey's" supposedly did happened centuries after the supposed war. Our fathers and grandfathers did a hell of a job destroying their lives and ways of living. Literally going onto the reservations and taking the children away from their mothers and sending them off to "schools", having 5 year old kids live with no parents in a dorm at the mercy of the nuns and priests. We all know the stories about the catholic schools in the east, well we had our own versions here, possibly much worse.
This site is testosterone fueled, I dont expect you to actually think about things, but understand this, there is more than one side to a story.
deaner
Active VIP Member
So youre the voice of intelligence and reason on this site? And everyone else on here is just some tard all pumped up on testosterone and adrenaline? Wow, what an elevated position you have given yourself. Must be nice up there looking down at all of these idiots.
I think most people realize there is more than one side to the story. Yes, the residential schools were horrible. Yes, alot of the government policies were horrible. So should we keep paying out our asses the rest of our life? How about our kids..........and thier kids? Is that going to make it better?? No its not. If you think it is such a great idea then how about you pay my share of taxes that goes to the natives?
Stompin Tom
Active VIP Member
Whats your solution? Lets sever all ties, walk away. Yup, real smart. All I hear from you is you think its wrong but you offer no solution. How about all the useless drunk and drug ridden "whitey's"? Its a far more complicated issue than you think.
As for intelligence and reason, sure isn't coming from you.
Stompin Tom
Active VIP Member
By the way, you do realize that allot of these things we are now paying for happened in the last 20 to 30 years, not hundreds of years ago as some of you seem to think.
SHIFTmx
Active VIP Member
It bothers me when I hear " think of what what your father and grand father did to them". I tell you what they did, my grandfather started a farm my grandmother was a teacher in a one room school, they didn't have much but were happy. My father and mother took over the farm and work harder than anyone I know. Our family hasn't hurt them at all. You know what a lot of fathers and grandfathers did! They fought in wars to keep this country what it is. Now we all have opportunities to better ourselves and live free.
deaner
Active VIP Member
My solution? Get rid of the reserve system. Give them the right to divide it up and sell it as they please.......or even divide it up for them so the corrupt chiefs and thier families wont find a way to keep everything for themselves. Set a 5-10 year deadline at which point all funding will be cut off. Focus on education and career training during this period. After the deadline, they are just like any other Canadian. If they need unemployment, they apply for it like any other guy. If they need career training, they provide it for themselves or access the same government programs that you or I would.
As far as the useless drunk and drug ridden whiteys??? Maybe they should be accountable for their own decisions and actions? Imagine that hey? No nanny state to babysit everyone. The socialism that you are advocating breeds laziness and dependancy. But, there will always be the bare bones government programs to provide the bare minimum. And the natives can use this same system.
But there is no use in argueing with a socialist. Im done here.
LennyR
Active VIP Member
Well it's not coming from you either. I made a couple suggestions as to what I think needs to happen, all you've done in my mind is tell everyone how they're at fault and we should feel bad about the existing situation. And stop blowing air up our rears about testosterone fueled comments and how when you were young blah blah, we were all young once and all have a different perspective than years ago, but bleeding hearts always talk about the past and the inequitys, but that ain't gonna put diapers on the baby tomorrow. It's a train wreck, and we need to look at how to fix it, not how it got broken.
Well actually that is the solution but not that brutally it needs to be fair and just. Reservation lands should be controlled by no one but the residents and with the present levels of curroption it should be divided and titled equally to each resident.You can't just cut off support when the dependency runs so deep after generations of support but a deadline is required as the mortgage payments need to end. During the weaning process funding should also go EQUALLY to each resident as we see first hand how the broken system divides the spoils. Continued grants on par with any other culture that resides in Canada is fair afterwards but no more and apply like the rest of us proud Canadians who have to fund our heritage preseravation, it actually builds pride.
These are only a few fair and just ways to correct a system which has proven that "absolute control breeds absolute curroption" on both sides of the fence.
There as surely other ways to equitably correct the present system and keep the Native Pride
Tom this may not suit you as you agree with endless support, a system with a proven track record of continued failure and growing corruption which time and again is exposed as a large part of the plight of the present reservation residents. Us "whiteys" you refer to agree to help but not endlessly, something that the lazy, corrupt and greedy will fight for forever and BTW they really stand out in a crowd, hunger strike or conversation.
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eclipse1966
Active VIP Member
you will need to read up the history a bit more. Getting off topic here but the Turks occupied Greece for 400 years until the Greeks fought back and gained their independence again in 1825. Thereafter, the battles continued and the rest is history just like we need to deal with the past when it comes to Canada and the current issues that continue to haunt our country.
mxzretta
Active VIP Member
How do you figure that you were the nicest about it. Have you seen the images of soldiers cutting the breasts off the women and playing catch with them on their bayonets? Or cutting the babies from their wombs? Indian massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia . The killing of the main food supply for the fun of it. How was this nice?
Attachments
DRD
Active VIP Member
From your link:
Determining how many people died in these overall is difficult. In the book The Wild Frontier: Atrocities during the American-Indian War from Jamestown Colony to Wounded Knee, amateur historian William M. Osborn sought to tally every recorded atrocity in the area that would eventually become the continental United States, from first contact (1511) to the closing of the frontier (1890), and determined that 7,193 people died from atrocities perpetrated by whites, and 9,156 people died from atrocities perpetrated by Native Americans. Osborn defines an atrocity as the , , or mutilation of civilians, the wounded, and prisoners. Different definitions would obviously produce different totals.[SUP][1]
Looks like more people died at the hands of native americans??
[/SUP]
Determining how many people died in these overall is difficult. In the book The Wild Frontier: Atrocities during the American-Indian War from Jamestown Colony to Wounded Knee, amateur historian William M. Osborn sought to tally every recorded atrocity in the area that would eventually become the continental United States, from first contact (1511) to the closing of the frontier (1890), and determined that 7,193 people died from atrocities perpetrated by whites, and 9,156 people died from atrocities perpetrated by Native Americans. Osborn defines an atrocity as the , , or mutilation of civilians, the wounded, and prisoners. Different definitions would obviously produce different totals.[SUP][1]
Looks like more people died at the hands of native americans??
[/SUP]
LennyR
Active VIP Member
Again, you only want to talk about and dwell on the parts of the past that will further justify continued blind brainless monetary support with no responsibility to improve the situation, just sit and moan and whine about how bad it was. God the " I'm useless and its your fault forever " group has to sack up and move on. I can't believe there hasn't been another Indian war, but I see it should be the regular reserve Indian uprising against their own elected officials and chiefs, thats the war that make the most difference to their lot. But nope, too many keep wallowing in the past, and using that for their justification to continue to be lazy and irresponsible, so save your babies on a stick stories, history is full of them, it was yesterday and all it'll do is breed more stories about the Indians horrible actions in the same war.
100 + friggen years, figure out how much money has been spent , then figure out how much is being spent annually right now and how many Indians are still reserve and recipients. Then take a close look at the existing situation, then tell us again how they've been disadvantaged. Any really good business manager could improve the lives of all these people ten fold in no time, at a fraction of what's being spent, but that's not what they want, cause it would mean equality and personal responsibility for themselves and their families, which we all have to deal with, except them. We've caused an entire generation of kids to actually believe they can go their whole lives without working, at all, that's sad. It's gonna suck for some, and hurt, but it has to change.
rsaint
Active VIP Member
The more you can get for nothing the more u try to get. All the money going to the reserves should sustain a better quality of life for them. When the government cannot make them accountable to where the money is going corruption is happening on both sides of the fence at all levels of leadership.
That would be correct but this is American history and not "Canadian" and it is nothing more than the past, something that no one is responsible for on either side today nor does it have a bearing on the present situation in CANADA TODAY!
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