Wicked day on a Sidewinder!

[chickenman]

They are significantly different, i thought the same until i really look into them, the outer appearance seems that way but they are not. Even though they use the same tunnel, front and rear suspension. The BULK HEAD is the big difference, it mounts the front and rear suspension in relation to the engine a lot different.
The engine sits farther back, so less weight is carried by the front and more is carried by the rear. They also had to redesign the fuel tank to accommodate the new lay out, this in turn moved more of the fuel weight over the chassis.
These changes are drastic by making the sled carry its own weight, with less ski spindle weight the rider input is dramatically improved.
Going back to the Nytro day's, that was the #1 issue why the Nytro felt so heavy. Too much spindle weight and not enough weight spread over the chassis.
A lot of Nytro riders figured this out by installing foreward mounted A-arms, this made a huge difference in weight vs rider input. The same principle apply's here with the new SW.

IMO the engineering aspect of this machine is amazing, there is almost no difference in weight between a Nytro, Viper and Sidewinder. Yet the Sidewinder feel's from what i'm hearing 100lbs lighter to ride. Simply, its all about geometry and awesome engineering.

Im seeing the differences in bulkhead and minor body changes, but the prices that the cary over '15s are going for is crazy. add the 2016 front end / an MCX kit and stretch to 174 and you still will have almost 4-5G still in your pocket if you do it right. both sleds would be great, but its things a guy thinks about when we talk about putting out 20+G

 

[d mills]

The weight difference depends on the sled, the sidewinder with fuel is in the 630 isn pounds and the G4 with fuel is in the 570 ish area with electric start. An Axy is super light so there is more than 100 pounds difference. I have a straight pipe and lightweight battery on my sidewinder and have dropped 30 pounds off already which is very noticeable on the can side for sure. I will be doing a seat mod and a air intake which will drop a few more pounds off and I will leave it after that because it is easy to ride already.

The sidewinder sounds like a awesome sled. But let's not blow the misinformation out of proportion. That's for us doo guys to do. Lol

 

[Bnorth]

The sidewinder sounds like a awesome sled. But let's not blow the misinformation out of proportion. That's for us doo guys to do. Lol

I believe that was a 165 doo vs a 174 axys so add e-start to the g4 and the 570# is close.

 

[niner]

That's a 154 pull start. So add more for a 165 and electric start. So Paul has dropped 30 lbs off his, he's within 40 lbs of a G4. And a gazillion more hp.

 

[deaner]

So its not truly apples to apples......but to look at each sled in its lightest form (just doing the easy things....can, battery, etc), it looks like there is an honest 50lbs difference between the two. Around 540 for a pull start G4 with a can, or 590 for a yammi with exhaust, battery, and hood. Thats actually not that bad. Do the overall power to weight and the yammi might actually be a pretty fun sled if the chassis is working well.

Say the average rider is 250lbs geared up.....thats 790lbs on a 130hp (at elevation), or 840 lbs with 200+ hp at elevation

 

[Rotax_Kid]

https://youtu.be/Qjdb9HfUbUk

A little clip from Saturday.

Man do I Miss that sound...had a boosted 1200 that I think rsaint still owns and there is no 2 stroke that can replicate that music no matter how good your pipe or can is...

 

[skegpro]

That's a 154 pull start. So add more for a 165 and electric start. So Paul has dropped 30 lbs off his, he's within 40 lbs of a G4. And a gazillion more hp.

There was picture on here somewhere in the 100's of pages of 850 problems that showed a 165" G4 with esart full of fluids was 590 lbs.

Slap a turbo on that and I bet you are cresting 600lb. Especially an intercooled turbo.

 

[Pistonbroke]

Say the average rider is 250lbs geared up.....thats 790lbs on a 130hp (at elevation), or 840 lbs with 200+ hp at elevation

I've been saying this for a long time and it gets real quiet in the Bring Rings and Pistons camp every time I do...LMFAO

 

[pistoncontracting]

A 'proper' BOV would definitely add to the experience, IMO. I've always wondered why they choose to hide the sound on these, as well at the 1100 cats from factory??

 

[Bnorth]

A 'proper' BOV would definitely add to the experience, IMO. I've always wondered why they choose to hide the sound on these, as well at the 1100 cats from factory??

because a recirc valve gives better throttle response when on-off-on-off the throttle like is so common in sledding.

 

[deaner]

I've been saying this for a long time and it gets real quiet in the Bring Rings and Pistons camp every time I do...LMFAO

 

[pistoncontracting]

because a recirc valve gives better throttle response when on-off-on-off the throttle like is so common in sledding.

Sure does, but some are noisyer then others.... just saying....

 

[174mcx]

I had a 12 pro with a boost it WA and a baker 174 3" 15 wide, it weighed 606lbs full of fuel and oil ready to ride. At the same time I had a Nypex with a boost-it WA and a baker 174 3" 16 wide, it weighed 680 full of fuel ready to ride.


My 2 cents, power to weight ratio was alot different!

 

[chickenman]

I had a 12 pro with a boost it WA and a baker 174 3" 15 wide, it weighed 606lbs full of fuel and oil ready to ride. At the same time I had a Nypex with a boost-it WA and a baker 174 3" 16 wide, it weighed 680 full of fuel ready to ride.


My 2 cents, power to weight ratio was alot different!

running what power in both?

 

[LBZ]

https://youtu.be/Qjdb9HfUbUk

A little clip from Saturday.

Sorry if I missed it but we're the mods if any done to this sled?

 

[Lund]

I had a 12 pro with a boost it WA and a baker 174 3" 15 wide, it weighed 606lbs full of fuel and oil ready to ride. At the same time I had a Nypex with a boost-it WA and a baker 174 3" 16 wide, it weighed 680 full of fuel ready to ride.


My 2 cents, power to weight ratio was alot different!

I don't really understand why people continually compare 2 and 4 strokes, IMO they do not compare. You either ride and prefer the lighter, simpler version of a mountain snowmobile, so your game is 2 stroke or prefer the reliability and power of a 4 stroke at the cost of weight.
Even turboed a 2stroke can not and will not compare to a 4stroke turbo, same with a 4stroke will not and cannot compare to a 2stroke in the weight category, no matter how much weight you strip out. A 4 stroke motor is just heavier with more moving parts.

There are pro and cons to both.

IMO, when it comes to weight, if that is a concern to anyone looking at these 4 strokes, then 4 stroke ain't for you. Because weight is not why you would get into one of these.
The weight war or dilemma is more a 2 stroke thing.

 

[Lund]

I've been saying this for a long time and it gets real quiet in the Bring Rings and Pistons camp every time I do...LMFAO

Most dismiss 4stroke's as "tank's" or "pig's", so they don't have a clue.

 

[Lund]

BTW, i'm finding out that the SW is geared to low and considerable more track speed can be had. Also more weight to the clutch is needed if you install a down pipe and fresh air kit.

 

[Andrew.renegade1000]

Lethal motorsports guys said with just a straight pipe it was revving at the desired rpms, that's without the fresh air kit tho!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[06yamahaapex]

They are significantly different, i thought the same until i really look into them, the outer appearance seems that way but they are not. Even though they use the same tunnel, front and rear suspension. The BULK HEAD is the big difference, it mounts the front and rear suspension in relation to the engine a lot different.
The engine sits farther back, so less weight is carried by the front and more is carried by the rear. They also had to redesign the fuel tank to accommodate the new lay out, this in turn moved more of the fuel weight over the chassis.
These changes are drastic by making the sled carry its own weight, with less ski spindle weight the rider input is dramatically improved.
Going back to the Nytro day's, that was the #1 issue why the Nytro felt so heavy. Too much spindle weight and not enough weight spread over the chassis.
A lot of Nytro riders figured this out by installing foreward mounted A-arms, this made a huge difference in weight vs rider input. The same principle apply's here with the new SW.

IMO the engineering aspect of this machine is amazing, there is almost no difference in weight between a Nytro, Viper and Sidewinder. Yet the Sidewinder feel's from what i'm hearing 100lbs lighter to ride. Simply, its all about geometry and awesome engineering.

after taking some time and looking at the parts catalog for each i still dont see many differences....even the whole chain case is the exact same...i understand that they can move everything back but then the chain case would have to be farther back or rolled back which is not the case with the sidewinder.....the fuel tank may have been redesigned to accommodate the new header?? im not trying to start an argument here i just dont see how its night and day different from the viper with the new style front end. The steering is the exact same part numbers as the 2014 vipers lol.