Snowmobile insurance in BC

[Tchetek]

That's a tough one Tchetek, if you do not purchase collision or all perils coverage, your insurance company CANNOT pursue a 3rd party on your behalf. The most they can do is send a demand letter, the rest is up to the individual to deal with the liable 3rd parties insurance. This is how this would've played out in ballsdeep's situation. Not a matter of trying to screw their customer, a matter of they cannot, legally. I can say, I've had customers in this situation and wanted to help them - you just can't, beyond advice and guidance.

I retract the word screw!

Would the correct statement be:

Will not attempt to help you!

 

[Tchetek]

I was told by the agent today, that insurance on private land is not a legal requirement. So best guess is staging from private and riding onto crown land does not require insurance.

If you were the victim in the unfortunate owls head accident situation, would you not prefer to have your own insurance company in your corner to help battle a life changing situation?

 

[Tchetek]

I agree, it’s brutal. I guess it depends who you have your business through wether they do what they can or wash their hands of if.

How about a compromise: a good broker will help as much as they legally can!

I argree! Everyone should have insurance unless you operate strictly on private land!

 

[acesup800]

. They cant register the sled unless it has previously been registered.

That is an incorrect statement.

[h=3]If the ORV was purchased used[/h]

[h=3]​ORV from B.C. or Canada, you'll need:[/h]

• Out-of-province registration documents if imported from a jurisdiction that has an ORV registry; or full continuity of ownership (if not previously registered) and
  
• Bill of sale from dealer or Transfer/Tax form (APV9T) signed by seller(s) and
  
• BC Consumer Taxation Branch Gift of Vehicle form (FIN 319) if applicable e.g. vehicle was a gift or
  
• Missing Signature Declaration form (MV1484) where required if any of the above documents are missing.*Note: Missing Signature Declaration form (MV1484) is not acceptable in lieu of Gift of Vehicle Form (FIN 319)

 

[LBZ]

I took this from ICBC website.

https://www.icbc.com/vehicle-registration/specialty-vehicles/Pages/Off-road-vehicles.aspx

That reads to me if you stage and ride on private land and don’t ride on or cross an fsr or crown land you are not required to have insurance or registration.

If you want to ride crown land you need registration and if you touch a public road or fsr with your machine you need third party liability.

 

[FernieHawk]

That is an incorrect statement.

If the ORV was purchased used



​ORV from B.C. or Canada, you'll need:

• Out-of-province registration documents if imported from a jurisdiction that has an ORV registry; or full continuity of ownership (if not previously registered) and
• Bill of sale from dealer or Transfer/Tax form (APV9T) signed by seller(s) and
• BC Consumer Taxation Branch Gift of Vehicle form (FIN 319) if applicable e.g. vehicle was a gift or
• Missing Signature Declaration form (MV1484) where required if any of the above documents are missing.*Note: Missing Signature Declaration form (MV1484) is not acceptable in lieu of Gift of Vehicle Form (FIN 319)

Yes...poor wording on my part. What I meant to say was concerning the continuity of ownership issue.

I purchased a used travel trailer and had it delivered to the rural home I was building at the time...used it for temporary accommodation during construction.

I never had it registered as it was sitting on private land the whole time. Sold the trailer after two years. The new owner could not get it registered till I registered (two years after my purchase) and paid the PST.

 

[52weekbreak]

Part of the challenge here I think is that we are often expressing the experience in different provinces as though the same rules apply everywhere. They do not. To try and summarize:

1. Snowmobiles or any vehicle for that matter does not need to be registered or insured if it never leaves YOUR private land. It is foolish IMO to not have insurance even in these situations because bad things can happen anywhere even at your own place.
2. The same applies to private land of others except it becomes that extra bit of foolish to not have insurance. You must trailer between properties and cannot use in transit as an excuse.
3. If you are in any public land where encountering others then it is more likely that something could go wrong and the insurance coverage would be needed. In Alberta, that is everywhere. In BC, some suggest that is not legally the case and that might be true but is irrelevant as to do so is just a bad decision right up there with high marking in an avalanche area with active warnings but do what you want.
4. Registration of the vehicle is, in Alberta, a separate item from insurance. It is only required here if going off of your private land. Many don't bother and just buy insurance and will take the ticket if caught. Whatever. That is the downside - a ticket. Running into someone and seriously injuring them exposes you to a lawsuit for injuries and that could bankrupt you for years to come.
5. Registration of a motor vehicle in BC is tied in with the insurance BUT that is not the case for snowmobiles. You can purchase separate insurance from private sources at reasonable prices.
6. As pointed out in this thread, what makes the insurance expensive is the physical damage insurance on the sled - collision and comprehensive - without which your insurer cannot help you recover from someone else who ran into you. Most of us can walk away from a written off sled but are not likely to be able to cough up $500,000 or more if forced to so it is outright foolish IMO to not bother buying at least the liability coverage.

But go ahead and save the $65.

 

[FernieHawk]

Part of the challenge here I think is that we are often expressing the experience in different provinces as though the same rules apply everywhere. They do not. To try and summarize:

1. Snowmobiles or any vehicle for that matter does not need to be registered or insured if it never leaves YOUR private land. It is foolish IMO to not have insurance even in these situations because bad things can happen anywhere even at your own place.
2. The same applies to private land of others except it becomes that extra bit of foolish to not have insurance. You must trailer between properties and cannot use in transit as an excuse.
3. If you are in any public land where encountering others then it is more likely that something could go wrong and the insurance coverage would be needed. In Alberta, that is everywhere. In BC, some suggest that is not legally the case and that might be true but is irrelevant as to do so is just a bad decision right up there with high marking in an avalanche area with active warnings but do what you want.
4. Registration of the vehicle is, in Alberta, a separate item from insurance. It is only required here if going off of your private land. Many don't bother and just buy insurance and will take the ticket if caught. Whatever. That is the downside - a ticket. Running into someone and seriously injuring them exposes you to a lawsuit for injuries and that could bankrupt you for years to come.
5. Registration of a motor vehicle in BC is tied in with the insurance BUT that is not the case for snowmobiles. You can purchase separate insurance from private sources at reasonable prices.
6. As pointed out in this thread, what makes the insurance expensive is the physical damage insurance on the sled - collision and comprehensive - without which your insurer cannot help you recover from someone else who ran into you. Most of us can walk away from a written off sled but are not likely to be able to cough up $500,000 or more if forced to so it is outright foolish IMO to not bother buying at least the liability coverage.

But go ahead and save the $65.

Thanks for your contribution to the thread, but as stated in my first post I was looking for info about the legal insurance requirements for B.C. as I believe the ICBC agents were incorrect in the information they provided me

I have ICBC liability as well as liability thru Oasis insurance.

 

[FernieHawk]

The last time I registered a sled under the new BC system, you were given a lifetime plate and did not require ICBC liability and you did not require an annual sticker. Liability insurance through a third party insurer was optional.

Now it looks like ICBC has set up another annual cash cow so I have to pay an annual fee for registration and insurance so I can legally ride from one of the official staging areas to the unplowed FSR even if I already have liability insurance through Oasis.

The CO’s or cops in the staging areas will be looking for the up to date annual plate sticker that proves you are legal to ride the one or two hundred feet from your truck to the trail head.

Pisses me off!!!!!!

 

[acesup800]

The last time I registered a sled under the new BC system, you were given a lifetime plate and did not require ICBC liability and you did not require an annual sticker. Liability insurance through a third party insurer was optional.

Now it looks like ICBC has set up another annual cash cow so I have to pay an annual fee for registration and insurance so I can legally ride from one of the official staging areas to the unplowed FSR even if I already have liability insurance through Oasis.

The CO’s or cops in the staging areas will be looking for the up to date annual plate sticker that proves you are legal to ride the one or two hundred feet from your truck to the trail head.

Pisses me off!!!!!!

I don't think this is the case. Registration is only a one time event while you own the snowmobile. You do not require ICBC insurance unless you are crossing a highway. 3rd party liability is also not required in BC. They just don't want snowmobiles on plowed FSR's. If it is unplowed, you are good to go legally with no insurance. If it plowed, you are not supposed to be on it, whether insured or not.

At almost all of the plowed parking lots I have seen, they are not part of the FSR and private or crown, legally you do not need insurance on a snowmobile. If you get hassled for not having insurance in a parking lot because they are claiming it is a plowed FSR, then it doesn't matter if you have insurance or not, you cannot be legally on plowed FSR regardless.

 

[gunner3006]

We have kind of a unique situation here in grande prairie. For kakwa we stage in Alberta and the first part of the trail is Alberta. Then cross into B.C. both times I’ve been stopped by the fuzz was on the west side of the cabin in bc, and both times I was asked for registration and proof of insurance. To further this conversation, I was also asked for the same things at the staging area for Chappell two years ago. Makes a guy wonder.

 

[new_nytro]

Think of it this way. There is no legal requirement for you to have house insurance. If someone comes to your house and slips on some ice on your sidewalk does that mean you are not liable because insurance isn't required? I think people are confusing the requirement to have insurance versus legal liability. The fact that you don't need insurance doesn't mean you can't be held liable in the event of an accident. This would especially be true in the case of negligence which likely could be argued when someone enters the road way without checking for oncoming traffic.

 

[acesup800]

We have kind of a unique situation here in grande prairie. For kakwa we stage in Alberta and the first part of the trail is Alberta. Then cross into B.C. both times I’ve been stopped by the fuzz was on the west side of the cabin in bc, and both times I was asked for registration and proof of insurance. To further this conversation, I was also asked for the same things at the staging area for Chappell two years ago. Makes a guy wonder.

Just because they ask for insurance, doesn't mean you legally require it.

 

[FernieHawk]

I don't think this is the case. Registration is only a one time event while you own the snowmobile. You do not require ICBC insurance unless you are crossing a highway. 3rd party liability is also not required in BC. They just don't want snowmobiles on plowed FSR's. If it is unplowed, you are good to go legally with no insurance. If it plowed, you are not supposed to be on it, whether insured or not.

At almost all of the plowed parking lots I have seen, they are not part of the FSR and private or crown, legally you do not need insurance on a snowmobile. If you get hassled for not having insurance in a parking lot because they are claiming it is a plowed FSR, then it doesn't matter if you have insurance or not, you cannot be legally on plowed FSR regardless.

That is exactly what I thought until I went to ICBC yesterday.

They are now issuing annual stickers for your plate if you want to be able to stage at plowed staging...the agent specifically mentioned the Morrissey staging area. Coal creek might be different because it is private property.

I’m not sure what the frick the real rules are.

 

[FernieHawk]

Think of it this way. There is no legal requirement for you to have house insurance. If someone comes to your house and slips on some ice on your sidewalk does that mean you are not liable because insurance isn't required? I think people are confusing the requirement to have insurance versus legal liability. The fact that you don't need insurance doesn't mean you can't be held liable in the event of an accident. This would especially be true in the case of negligence which likely could be argued when someone enters the road way without checking for oncoming traffic.

Please see post #32.

If I already have liability through Oasis, which I do, the nice ICBC agent is telling me I now have to have additional ICBC annual insurance/ registration to legally stage at a plowed crown land staging area.

 

[52weekbreak]

The last time I registered a sled under the new BC system, you were given a lifetime plate and did not require ICBC liability and you did not require an annual sticker. Liability insurance through a third party insurer was optional.

Now it looks like ICBC has set up another annual cash cow so I have to pay an annual fee for registration and insurance so I can legally ride from one of the official staging areas to the unplowed FSR even if I already have liability insurance through Oasis.

The CO’s or cops in the staging areas will be looking for the up to date annual plate sticker that proves you are legal to ride the one or two hundred feet from your truck to the trail head.

Pisses me off!!!!!!

I now understand your request. Don't have time to research the answer now but will look into it later. Sounds like BC is following AB by requiring annual renewal of registration and of course charging a fee. Money grubbers.

 

[acesup800]

That is exactly what I thought until I went to ICBC yesterday.

They are now issuing annual stickers for your plate if you want to be able to stage at plowed staging...the agent specifically mentioned the Morrissey staging area. Coal creek might be different because it is private property.

I’m not sure what the frick the real rules are.

The annual requirement is only for ICBC insurance. Below is from ICBC's website. A plowed staging area by definition is not an FSR and falls under "other crown land" and does not require insurance.

I get that the local CO or cop may not understand all the rules, but I wouldnt be getting the ICBC insurance. Heck, in 15 years, I haven't even been asked.

Insurance requirements

If you operate an ORV on or across highways, you're required to obtain ICBC’s Basic Insurance. If you operate an ORV on forest service roads, you'll need $200,000 in third party liability insurance. This may be obtained from ICBC or other insurers.
On all other Crown land, liability insurance is voluntary but recommended.

 

[toyz]

When I got mine I was told the plate is life time and insurance was optional. If i cross a highway or plowed FSR i need a minimum liability otherwise I do not need any insurance.

 

[FernieHawk]

So far it looks like the ICBC agents don’t know the rules or are intentionally misleading customers. Next year I will probably only get the liability insurance from Capri.

 

[FernieHawk]

Found this info on a BCSF document.

1. If you are only riding your snowmobile on Crown or privately owned land you do not
require insurance.

2. If you are crossing a plowed Forest Service Road (FSR) or unloading in a plowed parking
lot off of a FSR you are required to purchase Liability Insurance. This can be purchased
from Capri Insurance with your BCSF membership or from your broker of choice.

3. If you are crossing highways, using highway right of ways, or unloading in plowed
parking lots off the side of the highway than you are required to buy ICBC ORV
Insurance. This can be purchased at any ICBC location and you will be provided with an
annual decal to affix to your plate verifying your insurance.


Everything I have found online, as well as information provided in this thread indicates that the BCSF info shown above is correct.

This means the ICBC agents I dealt with a couple of days ago are providing false information to customers. I will be contacting a manager at the Insurance company to see what they have to say.