Snow Bike Revolution

[Mtdgt]

As a dedicated & passionate snowmobiler I am seeing a number of my buddies switching from sleds to snow bikes. They all seem to be riding 4- strokes rather than 2- strokes, why is that? Apparently you need to service the 4 strokes after 2- rides and you need to rebuild them after a full season of riding. It seems like a lot of extra work and cost?
The guys making the switch seem to be tree riders and swear by the additional freedom and territory you can ride in. Anyone else considering making the switch?

 

[250mark1]

4strokes have better low end power than a 2stroke. Plus I would want a fuel injected bike so there is no worrying about changing jets for the changes in elevation and temperature

 

[ABMax24]

I would imagine that the 2-strokes would have more maintenance to them, i can't imagine a 2-stroke bike is built to run wide-open all day long either, and like has been already said not having to jet for temperature or elevation is a big plus, and they are not very good outside of their narrow power-band. Sleds seem to be the only machines commonly using 2-strokes nowadays, most everything else has gone to 4-stroke for emissions and reliability reasons.

 

[pat84]

I'm on a YZ450 and a Timbersled ST. I think the reason most people are using 4 strokes is because they're EFI, some are electric start and have a battery which means easy to add on accessories (handle bar warmers, lights, other electronics) Also they're pretty much bolt on and go because they are proven. Lots of the tinkerer types are going to 500 2 strokes. They take a little more work to get snow ready, different carbs and carb warmers and I've read guys talking about mounting tunnel coolers because the rads aren't sufficient enough and coolant temps are all over the place. Some guys doing 300 2 stokes too. The oil changes aren't a huge deal. A liter out, a liter in and every second change do the filter too. I do really enjoy riding the snowbike, glad I made the move!

 

[Mtdgt]

Thanks for the insight, I'm definately going to try one this season.

 

[ducati]

Have rode two of them now and was close to making the move this year if it wasn't for our brutal dollar and the price of the kits. That is after 20 years of riding sleds in the mountains.

Both i rode were 4 strokes (YZF-450 and 450-XC) and i used to race a 450 SXF in supermoto. My current ride is a Husky TE300 two stroke though which is due to the low maintenance and light weight. You are exactly right that the oil needs done after every weekend of riding, valve checks every 20 hours at most and when you go to rebuild it is very pricey. A two stroke leaves out the valve maintenance, still needs tranny oil changed (not as often as a 4 stroke needs engine oil) and will still require looking at after a season however a top end for a two stroke is very cheap in comparison to a 4 stroke and can be done by anyone with a little bit of mechanical prowess, personally i wouldn't even know where to start with a 4 stroke. Same can be said for items like exhaust (2 stroke $350 for a full exhaust vs 4 stroke at $1000+) or head (2 stroke $200 vs $$$$$$$$ for a 4 stroke).

If i was building a snow bike i would start with my 300 and put on an APT Smart Carb to eliminate jetting constantly. Would then do a high compression head ($200), FMF Fatty exhaust and shorty silencer ($350), and bolt up parts like larger pegs, seat, hand warmers and large hand guards.

Also, when picking a bike i wouldn't even entertain using one that doesn't have E-Start. I stalled the YZF in a really bad spot on a tough sidehill and had a hell of a time getting it kicked over again.

 

[vodoo103]

I'll also make the switch eventually, and the sled I'm currently on might be my last mountain sled. I think we'll see a lot of changes in the snow-bike industry in the next few years and I'm interested to see if the manufacturers get involved more.

Why a snow bike instead of a sled? Any spot there's 24" between trees is a new trail for a snow bike. Side-hills don't really exist on a snowbike since you're just riding up a hill on an angle or traversing across. Areas that are completely pounded out by sleds still normally have lots of terrain for snow-bikes. Don't care about the speed anymore - more about "where" we are riding.

I'd want fuel injection in the mountains and the 4 stroke snow-bike I was on last season did way better in the low end when you let it tractor around a bit instead of keeping the revs higher. I've considered converting my 300 XC-W for the winter, but the carb. & the low end grunt of the WR450 snow bike have kept me from making the jump. The 300 has plenty of low end grunt but it's not the same feel as a 4 stroke. I'd want to ride a 2 stroke snow bike before I commit to converting my 300. Be interesting to ride a 2 stroke and a 4 on the same day.

For anyone that's never been on a snow bike, don't expect it to feel much like riding a dirt bike. It's a completely different experience.

 

[jrusher]

4 strokes have way better bottom end torque and grunt like others have said. If you keep engine temps up on the 4 stroke with a thermostat etc and run leaner fuel mapping or a fuel controller you can go longer between oil changes. Ive run my yz450 last 2 seasons on snow about 40 hrs and valves and leak down are within spec.. A well set-up bike for snow is key. They shine in the trees or in real technical terrain you look at the mountain an lines you can take in a whole different way and you can always find fresh snow or untracked stuff to ride. If you ride big open stuff or like doing big pulls it wont be fun you dont have the track speed. They do have alot of ski pressure which is great for the trail or climbing but you wont get the light front end feel or wheeling unless you change your skid settings up alot. The new TSS shock timber has out is supposed to help give bike the light front end feel and still climb well we shall see. I was the only one in our group with a bike last couple seasons this season theres gonna be around 10 snowbikes in group so should be crazy fun.. I still have sled for real deep days but that will change soon as theres a bike out with more ponnies

 

[etecheaven]

I will rent a snowbike this year and believe I will never buy a new sled again. From what I hear, snow bikes are for me. Cant wait!

 

[jrusher]

I forgot to mention how much easier it is on your body riding the bikes. I can ride day after day after day on snow bike and not get burnt out and my knees dont ache like after riding sled. Not getting any younger I guess, I almost get lazy on snow bike cause its that much easier then I dont even wanna ride my sled unless its stupid deep out

4 strokes have way better bottom end torque and grunt like others have said. If you keep engine temps up on the 4 stroke with a thermostat etc and run leaner fuel mapping or a fuel controller you can go longer between oil changes. Ive run my yz450 last 2 seasons on snow about 40 hrs and valves and leak down are within spec.. A well set-up bike for snow is key. They shine in the trees or in real technical terrain you look at the mountain an lines you can take in a whole different way and you can always find fresh snow or untracked stuff to ride. If you ride big open stuff or like doing big pulls it wont be fun you dont have the track speed. They do have alot of ski pressure which is great for the trail or climbing but you wont get the light front end feel or wheeling unless you change your skid settings up alot. The new TSS shock timber has out is supposed to help give bike the light front end feel and still climb well we shall see. I was the only one in our group with a bike last couple seasons this season theres gonna be around 10 snowbikes in group so should be crazy fun.. I still have sled for real deep days but that will change soon as theres a bike out with more ponnies

 

[barefooter]

Well. My story. 2 years ago I rode my first snowbike. Built my first one last year. Sold 6 sled in the interim. No sleds left. That is after 15 years of riding a sled in the mountains.

I you like 2 strokes in the dirt - you will love them on the snow. Take a little more set-up out of the box, but once they are dialed with a Smartcarb or Lectron, it is a no touch - go and ride. I presently have a KTM 300XC.

I will be building a second bike - but a 4 stroke. It will be on the new Yamaha YZ450FX chassis. If you have a snowbike - estart and a battery is a must (IMHO). Other than KTM, the WR450 was the only other choice in the "Big 5". It was a little heavy and down on power compared to the YZ\RM\KX\SX lines. I never went with a KTM 4-stroke as I have always found them to be a bit temperamental and have to be maintained religiously. But now Yammie dependability and power with e-start, I won't even think twice about a 4 stroke next year.

They are different rides. The 300 (or in my case 330) is a zinger. It wants to be thrown around, ridden hard and put away wet. For tree riding it is the shizzle. The 4 strokes are a little more laid back, forgiving ride. Horsepower is also way cheaper on a two stroke, and that coupled with about a 20 lb weight difference makes it a different animal. Not better, or worse, just different.

 

[Bnorth]

Have rode two of them now and was close to making the move this year if it wasn't for our brutal dollar and the price of the kits. That is after 20 years of riding sleds in the mountains.

Both i rode were 4 strokes (YZF-450 and 450-XC) and i used to race a 450 SXF in supermoto. My current ride is a Husky TE300 two stroke though which is due to the low maintenance and light weight. You are exactly right that the oil needs done after every weekend of riding, valve checks every 20 hours at most and when you go to rebuild it is very pricey. A two stroke leaves out the valve maintenance, still needs tranny oil changed (not as often as a 4 stroke needs engine oil) and will still require looking at after a season however a top end for a two stroke is very cheap in comparison to a 4 stroke and can be done by anyone with a little bit of mechanical prowess, personally i wouldn't even know where to start with a 4 stroke. Same can be said for items like exhaust (2 stroke $350 for a full exhaust vs 4 stroke at $1000+) or head (2 stroke $200 vs $$$$$$$$ for a 4 stroke).

If i was building a snow bike i would start with my 300 and put on an APT Smart Carb to eliminate jetting constantly. Would then do a high compression head ($200), FMF Fatty exhaust and shorty silencer ($350), and bolt up parts like larger pegs, seat, hand warmers and large hand guards.

Also, when picking a bike i wouldn't even entertain using one that doesn't have E-Start. I stalled the YZF in a really bad spot on a tough sidehill and had a hell of a time getting it kicked over again.

Does your husky smoker have a magic button?

 

[ducati]

Does your husky smoker have a magic button?

Absolutely. Not too many Katoom products (Husky's are about 99% KTM) don't have the button now when you get into the larger cc's both 2 and 4 stroke.

 

[HILCLMR]

After doing a lot of reading and talking with guys that ride snowbikes, I decided to take the plunge, however I'm not the type of guy to let someone else build it. I picked up a 07 KTM 525 XC-W, its got electric start, upgraded stator, back up kick start and a ton of other goodies.
I do wish for fuel injection, however I wasn't to keen on spending to much $$$, needed the cost to be reasonable.
All in I will have a fresh engine, 2015 T sled kit and not need to buy race fuel or haul my 28 ft enclosed around anymore.
Keeping my fingers crossed, but really how can someone not have fun on these things?
See you guys out there!

PS my 2010 snopro 900 big bore with a 162 x 3 is for sale!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[ducati]

After doing a lot of reading and talking with guys that ride snowbikes, I decided to take the plunge, however I'm not the type of guy to let someone else build it. I picked up a 07 KTM 525 XC-W, its got electric start, upgraded stator, back up kick start and a ton of other goodies.
I do wish for fuel injection, however I wasn't to keen on spending to much $$$, needed the cost to be reasonable.
All in I will have a fresh engine, 2015 T sled kit and not need to buy race fuel or haul my 28 ft enclosed around anymore.
Keeping my fingers crossed, but really how can someone not have fun on these things?
See you guys out there!

PS my 2010 snopro 900 big bore with a 162 x 3 is for sale!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

My 08 450SXF was still carb'd. Once you get the tuning right it will run nice. Install a R&D Power Pump Adjustable leak jet, JD jet kit and the finger adjustable fuel screw to make tuning much easier. Those few items really cleaned my 450 up.

 

[Bnorth]

Interesting all of the 300s I've ridden were Kickstart. Must have been older.

 

[ducati]

Interesting all of the 300s I've ridden were Kickstart. Must have been older.

Any 300 Katoom from about 08 and up are electric start and most if not all have a kick backup. Before that they would be kick only I believe.

 

[norona]

Built up this yz250 and had it for the last two years, got the bike for 2600 bucks and bolted a kit on and ran with it, super cheap, no need for e-start or hand warmers...bike plain out rips...will be doing a beta 350 probably, no doubt these are super fun, does not replace sledding for me, but I got to do it all...this is a ktm 500, 450 and yz 250

 

[ducati]

Built up this yz250 and had it for the last two years, got the bike for 2600 bucks and bolted a kit on and ran with it, super cheap, no need for e-start or hand warmers...bike plain out rips...will be doing a beta 350 probably, no doubt these are super fun, does not replace sledding for me, but I got to do it all...this is a ktm 500, 450 and yz 250

That line through the creek!!!!! That is really what is attracting me to these things is the terrain it opens up. Sure you could take a sled in there and with enough skill you could get it through but if you have anyone of lesser skill in the group they would not be able to go. Nice video Norona!

 

[Meggamass]

I'm definitely looking into one myself, LOVE sleds but LOVE bike more. Plus they are easy to store and haul. Much smaller space needed for hauling and ease of loading!