Skidoo Turbo Issue with bogging at times Deep Snow

[jcjc1]

Picked up at dealer and drove to bc one had 6kms other one ill say under 200 as there both 2022 850 turbos

hopefully we can find out at some point what the problem was. makes me wonder how many are riding and don't know about the recall.

 

[maxwell]

You’ve got to be kidding….?!

So BRP doesn’t trust its own dealer (and a large one like Martin’s) to break paint on certain items to fix a problem? Tells me to avoid BRP like the plague.

$20-25k unit that doesn’t run correctly for 2 years. Doesn’t matter what manufacturer it is…they should be doing more. How much time and money has Ron spent on mountian trips only to know that when in the steep and deep, the sled is probably not going to run properly. You’d think that someone at Martin’s would be getting tired of seeing this unit continually on the doorstep. Hey Snopro -what’s the purpose of the “engineering team” at Kuster’s? One would think that Martin’s would deliver it there for them to look at??

hey man don't hate the player hate the game. I don't disagree with you but that's the process doesn't matter how big or good of a dealer you are. As far as the engineering team at Kusters that's not really their intent but hey maybe it will happen. They are there to look at sleds that come off the mountain from CKMP. I only know that because i bent an A arm on a prototype once and they were pretty interested in that lol!!

Big organizations have big processes. Most of the time that's fine but in situations like these it really does suck for the customer.

On the Etec non turbo we used to just swap parts across with a buddy until we eliminated the problem. That is no longer.

If something goes wrong with your turbo pray there's an engine code

 

[snopro]

Yes times have changed with all the sensors and tech in these new sleds

 

[snopro]

It’s the same for all the manufacturers

 

[lilduke]

Burn it

Sounds like the best option.

 

[ABMax24]

hey man don't hate the player hate the game. I don't disagree with you but that's the process doesn't matter how big or good of a dealer you are. As far as the engineering team at Kusters that's not really their intent but hey maybe it will happen. They are there to look at sleds that come off the mountain from CKMP. I only know that because i bent an A arm on a prototype once and they were pretty interested in that lol!!

Big organizations have big processes. Most of the time that's fine but in situations like these it really does suck for the customer.

On the Etec non turbo we used to just swap parts across with a buddy until we eliminated the problem. That is no longer.

If something goes wrong with your turbo pray there's an engine code

But it doesn't need to be that way. Anyone looking to gain hp from these turbos is combining it with a tune, which is extremely easy to make programming within the ECU to detect. Even if it doesn't need a tune the ECU could register that parameters like fuel flow or boost are outside expected values.

The same thing happened 20 years ago with diesel trucks when aftermarket tuners became commonplace and manufacturers began loosing millions on warranty work. None of the big 3 started marked bolts to check if they were removed, that's assinine, they gave techs the information to diagnose if a failure was caused by overstressing components from aftermarket modifications, and built software into the ECUs to detect when non-oem tuning was utilized.

To beat this deadhorse again, allowing for logging within the ECU would solve a problem like this thread is about, and allow BRP to easily see if the engine has been modified for performance. 2 birds, one stone.

 

[Caper11]

But it doesn't need to be that way. Anyone looking to gain hp from these turbos is combining it with a tune, which is extremely easy to make programming within the ECU to detect. Even if it doesn't need a tune the ECU could register that parameters like fuel flow or boost are outside expected values.

The same thing happened 20 years ago with diesel trucks when aftermarket tuners became commonplace and manufacturers began loosing millions on warranty work. None of the big 3 started marked bolts to check if they were removed, that's assinine, they gave techs the information to diagnose if a failure was caused by overstressing components from aftermarket modifications, and built software into the ECUs to detect when non-oem tuning was utilized.

To beat this deadhorse again, allowing for logging within the ECU would solve a problem like this thread is about, and allow BRP to easily see if the engine has been modified for performance. 2 birds, one stone.

BRP does that with the budds 2. I would imagine a dealer like rons would have the latest budds software.
The moment the sled is plugged in, a file is sent to BRP.
Maxwell is referring to seals on, The wastegate and the ECM, those cannot be broken without permission and documentation from BRP.
With all the backfiring and popping rons sled done I know BRP knows about the popping and backfiring, and I hear 2022 sleds doing it in vids already. So we’re the reeds checked

Unfortunately I believe Ron is at the mercy of the Dealer and BRP or try another dealer.
I had a 2011 etec that hesitated and popped, BRP said nothing was wrong, even after reviewing the video that was sent in.

If I was Ron I seriously would be looking for a snocheck back out right now.

 

[ABMax24]

BRP does that with the budds 2. I would imagine a dealer like rons would have the latest budds software.
The moment the sled is plugged in, a file is sent to BRP.
Maxwell is referring to seals on, The wastegate and the ECM, those cannot be broken without permission and documentation from BRP.
With all the backfiring and popping rons sled done I know BRP knows about the popping and backfiring, and I hear 2022 sleds doing it in vids already. So we’re the reeds checked

Unfortunately I believe Ron is at the mercy of the Dealer and BRP or try another dealer.
I had a 2011 etec that hesitated and popped, BRP said nothing was wrong, even after reviewing the video that was sent in.

If I was Ron I seriously would be looking for a snocheck back out right now.

Oh cool, so BRP can't/won't fix the issue, and if the customer breaks those seals doing their own diagnostics it voids warranty. So the solution is to reward BRP by purchasing another sled?

Am I the only one that thinks this process is f@cked?

 

[Caper11]

Oh cool, so BRP can't/won't fix the issue, and if the customer breaks those seals doing their own diagnostics it voids warranty. So the solution is to reward BRP by purchasing another sled?

Am I the only one that thinks this process is f@cked?

Why would the customer, or any customer mess with the wastegate linkage, or remove the ECM? Only one reason, added performance.

A customer can do anything they want to their sled, just don’t expect support for free when a problem happens.

Don’t forget, All dealers have to get work authorization from the manufacturers, it does not matter if is a sled or a truck. If work is performed before the diagnosis is sent in, than the dealer or the customer is on the hook for the repair.

 

[ABMax24]

Why would the customer, or any customer mess with the wastegate linkage, or remove the ECM? Only one reason, added performance.

A customer can do anything they want to their sled, just don’t expect support for free when a problem happens.

We're clearly not talking about the same parts here. I'm not talking about swapping ECU's or Wastegate actuators from machine to machine, I'm talking about swapping MAP and Back pressure sensors from machine to machine to find the source of the over fueling issue. My response stems from this statement below:

On the Etec non turbo we used to just swap parts across with a buddy until we eliminated the problem. That is no longer.

 

[maxwell]

We're clearly not talking about the same parts here. I'm not talking about swapping ECU's or Wastegate actuators from machine to machine, I'm talking about swapping MAP and Back pressure sensors from machine to machine to find the source of the over fueling issue. My response stems from this statement below:

yea, im not 100% sure which parts are marked and not. so im sure some can be swapped. But again, BRP isnt going to pay the dealer to do that unless its their idea with authorization so its on the dealer at that point i guess.
Ideally, BRP would just say figure the damn thing out. But i cant see it.

 

[MP Kid]

At the end of the day….Ron has a 2 year old sled with 2700km that is closer to being off warranty than when he first picked it up, made countless trips to the dealer, many ruined days (when it should’ve been the best/deepest days), and still no resolution…?!

I don’t know how anyone could defend the position that this is acceptable…?

I don’t even know “Ron”….

 

[lilduke]

Must not have been that bad if he has almost 3000kms on it!

 

[maxwell]

At the end of the day….Ron has a 2 year old sled with 2700km that is closer to being off warranty than when he first picked it up, made countless trips to the dealer, many ruined days (when it should’ve been the best/deepest days), and still no resolution…?!

I don’t know how anyone could defend the position that this is acceptable…?

I don’t even know “Ron”….

no one is defending anyone, just explaining the process. It is not acceptable.

 

[ferniesnow]

Sure glad we are rockin' our oldish iron!!

 

[bendy]

no one is defending anyone, just explaining the process. It is not acceptable.

As a Chrysler Master Tech... no it is not acceptable, but its just the way it is! If I can't diagnose the symptom based on the training and equipment I have, and calling the tech line with the symptom, no codes and not being able to duplicate the problem... you're facked! I honestly believe Ron should've/should be given a different sled to ride and they take his POS and figure it out! Happens all the time in the auto industry. Its a lot easier though when the vehicle is leased to get this type of thing resolved by threating to return the vehicle.

 

[maxwell]

As a Chrysler Master Tech... no it is not acceptable, but its just the way it is! If I can't diagnose the symptom based on the training and equipment I have, and calling the tech line with the symptom, no codes and not being able to duplicate the problem... you're facked! I honestly believe Ron should've/should be given a different sled to ride and they take his POS and figure it out! Happens all the time in the auto industry. Its a lot easier though when the vehicle is leased to get this type of thing resolved by threating to return the vehicle.

i agree that is also what should happen, especially after a YEAR going on year TWO, in my friends case aswell. But the problem this year is there isn't even any sleds to trade on if that was even an option.

 

[maxwell]

Sure glad we are rockin' our oldish iron!!

the sleds have actually been pretty remarkable considering what they are. But with thousands sold there will always be the odd Dud, just probability.

 

[Caper11]

We're clearly not talking about the same parts here. I'm not talking about swapping ECU's or Wastegate actuators from machine to machine, I'm talking about swapping MAP and Back pressure sensors from machine to machine to find the source of the over fueling issue. My response stems from this statement below:

We are, BRP or a dealer will not do that and send a sled out to the hill to see if it’s going to work.
My comment was about the authorization, some have higher levels of authorization like the seals that are on certain parts.

I’m not saying the process is acceptable, it’s how all manufacturers manage their warranty program now.

 

[ferniesnow]

the sleds have actually been pretty remarkable considering what they are. But with thousands sold there will always be the odd Dud, just probability.

I realize that and understand. Just trying to inject a little humour into the situation!!