"NEW" Yamaha 180 Hp Turbocharger Kit

[Summitboy]

The reason i want more info is because there is two of these miracle MPI kits in one of our groups. One guy is happy with his 180 Kit and the other had the upgrade kit which has a marginal power increase over the 180 kit. When asked about boost at altitude they were told direct it was 230HP at alt on 9psi on pump fuel. I almost fell off my chair when i heard this. How is it this kit makes 50hp more on 6 psi less than a comparable kit. I'm using the MCX as an example because the information on their kits is out their and the math works. I have no loyalty to them. I want to hear how this is done plain and simple. Head shim is the difference. Thats not enough to make this difference we are talking about. I'm not the only one wanting to know, just look back in the thread. I'm just the one brave enough to ask the questions. You can go ahead and protect your beloved kit and believe what you want. I'm just looking for answers for friends who were swindled into thinking this was the best kit on the snow and the results aren't there. I stumbled across this thread looking for info for them because they were on the mountain with issues with their MPI upgrade kit. I would ask the same questions with any other kit if we had the same issues. I might not be the direct customer of the MPI but i like to help my friends when they are having a crap time in the mountains ! I'm sorry to be the one to tell you something you don't want to hear. Blind faith doesn't work for me !

 

[TABSTER]

This is turning into a battle of wits with a unarmed man.

You call yourself the brave one asking all the questions that everyone wants to know. while many others see you as being a douche trying to trash a builders kit.

Presentation and/or delivery of your questions Or lack there of might be why your not getting any response.... Just a thought.

Sincerely,
just my opinion

 

[TABSTER]

Anyway, I am done hijacking your thread Darren. I like your product, it works , Its affordable, pump gas, reliable fun. I did not /do not feel dooped or mislead with what your kit are. And as you can tell I would recommend one to anyone as the service is amazing. The kits fit and finish is awesome. It's a fun turbo kit and I take it for what it is and nothing more.

J.m.o.

 

[Dtripps]

TABSTER,

I have the MPI 180 kit, and have been thinking about the upgrade, as previously posted. I did not bash anyone, as i love the 180 kit, but i want all the info on the upgrade as possible. I well be going down to talk to Darren soon, as he is a world of knowledge, but this form is for all to express their opinions on the MPI kit, and it is where i go to research the kit before i go talk to Darren.

If someone is having a problem with a kit talk to Darren, but why not post it on here to let everyone else know,
That just my Opinion!

 

[E&S]

"what fuel, head shim? all still with 180 kit turbo?"

bourgon- I was using pump premium(Shell 91) My sled uses a headshim with proper cam timing, And still using the 180 Mitz turbo with a fuel pump and intercooler, We tested with the ECU re-map with added/removed timing with 550 cc injectors and had great results. We ran outta turbine in the 17 psi range. Pulled really hard all weekend with a slight burble off idle. We also fixed the idle hunt issue and the hesitation before boost comes on which has been an issue with all Nytros stk or modified. We will be coming out with different levels of ECU mapping so no matter what kit it will work-Darren

 

[E&S]

The reason i want more info is because there is two of these miracle MPI kits in one of our groups. One guy is happy with his 180 Kit and the other had the upgrade kit which has a marginal power increase over the 180 kit. When asked about boost at altitude they were told direct it was 230HP at alt on 9psi on pump fuel. I almost fell off my chair when i heard this. How is it this kit makes 50hp more on 6 psi less than a comparable kit. I'm using the MCX as an example because the information on their kits is out their and the math works. I have no loyalty to them. I want to hear how this is done plain and simple. Head shim is the difference. Thats not enough to make this difference we are talking about. I'm not the only one wanting to know, just look back in the thread. I'm just the one brave enough to ask the questions. You can go ahead and protect your beloved kit and believe what you want. I'm just looking for answers for friends who were swindled into thinking this was the best kit on the snow and the results aren't there. I stumbled across this thread looking for info for them because they were on the mountain with issues with their MPI upgrade kit. I would ask the same questions with any other kit if we had the same issues. I might not be the direct customer of the MPI but i like to help my friends when they are having a crap time in the mountains ! I'm sorry to be the one to tell you something you don't want to hear. Blind faith doesn't work for me !

Have your buddy give me a call if he has some issues, I got no problem fixing on this forum but I'm reading all your posts over and over and not seeing that your buddy is having any running issues ? Darren

 

[bourgon]

summitboy
i have read all the posts a couple of times and the only one on here that dose not make sense is you your numbers are all over the place and these so called friends of yours have nothing to say on the mater that have the kits thats cuz they are happy with them i would think.
on your first post you said 2 lpb gains to get 50 hp i see on other posts 4.5 lpb.
in our second post you compare an apex mcx to a nitro mpi and the 240 mcx would eat the mpi alive, have you seen this? (no pick not true!)
on your third post you say the mcx makes 13 psi on a diff post 12 psi and on to 15 psi and 14 psi so what is it?
how do you compare 2 different kits when they are built diff and run diff boost and claim that one is better than the other?
you also claim that the mpi makes 6 at sea and needs to be 9 at revy and only makes 7 when i see 4.4 not 6 not 9 or 7
then on your last post you say the mpi puts out 50 more hp on 6 lpb less boost
what i get out of this is at test levels whatever they are i get 180 hp with less then 5 lpb and when i am at elev 6+ i run 5-7 depending on the day and i love it
the upgrater kit is running 9 lpb and i would think when i am up at elv it will be 9-11 lpb with no head shim and a intercooler which would be better power then the 180 kit.
so in short 10lpb no head shim makes 230 hp
12 psi with head shim makes 240 hp how is that so hard to understand. with a name like summit boy you ride a doo? and you are a boy so i can see how it is hard to comprehend!
so get your # strait before you cry about a kit you cant aford
oh ya and the 230 kit is a lot less money then the 240 kit just the head shim would be 2000 put in i would think. and the kit is almost a 1000 cheaper is what i have seen!

 

[Summitboy]

Here are the numbers:

MCX

Nytro 16T 180 HP (140 KPA)
Sea 6 psi
6500 8.7 psi

Nytro 16T 240 HP (190 KPA)
Sea 13 psi
6500 15.9 psi

Nytro 19T 270 HP (210 KPA)
Sea 15.9 psi
6500 18.9 psi

Keep in mind these are a little rounded and using 100KPA sea and 80KPA 6500.

Here are the MPI numbers in past posts:

MPI Nytro 180

Sea 4.4 psi
6500 6 psi

MPI Nytro 230
Sea 9 psi
6500 ? (11-12psi most likely)

Now looking at these numbers what do you see ? You see the MCX240 kit needs 13 psi. Lets call it 12 psi for 230HP sake. Why does it take MCX 12 psi to make 230HP and MPI230 only 9psi at sea level ? When comparing the 180 kits which are identical its the same issue, 4psi vs 6psi at sea. All i am asking for is a simple explanation of why 3psi less makes 230 HP ? At 6500 feet you need more boost to make the same HP at alt. There were a few peeps who thought 9psi at sea is the same at 6500 feet which is not the case. Again MCX 230 (240-1psi) needs 16psi versus MPI 12 psi at 6500 feet. I'm just looking for the explanation as to why ? Also thats when i found this thread to help them out. There was no information in it really so i asked for the info. I get you guys think i'm questioning the kit, and your right i am. I've looked at the kit and understand why guys and dealers like it. Simplicity and cost and it seems to work. I get it, but the info looks skewed from a numbers point of view.

We figured out the issue as to why the kit was not running correctly thinking it was the GEMS (history shows they don't seem to work well when wet). The Yamaha dealer who installed it put an injector in without one of the o-rings. Easy fix. When asked what boost he should run for the full 230HP at Revy 9psi was the number given. When i heard this it made no sense and i started looking. When the upgrade was compared to a MCX240 and a MPI180 the kit didn't seem to have much more power than the 180kit at 9psi. I believe and of course its my opinion which i believe i'm allowed to have is that the MPI ugrade kit maybe makes 200-210HP at 9psi at sea level . It would need 11-12psi to maintain it at 6500ft, That seems feesible with no head shim on pump fuel. Running the upgrade at the specified boost (9psi) at 6500 feet felt like a 180 kit maybe with a slight increase. This may also explain why a earlier poster claims he made no clutching changes in the primary when he upgraded. Now having said all this and making it clear what is the maximum number this kit should see at 6500 feet on pump fuel, no head shim without deto ? Would you say 12psi ? 13psi ? MCX uses a shim at 13 ? How close is 12psi on the edge of deto without the shim ?

You can personally attack me all you like, you can think what you like about what i can and can't afford. I can tell you this. I own a turbo sled. Ive been riding it for 7 seasons. I have installed numerous head shims and kits. I would never own a 180 kit, not much better than stock in my opinion. I was helping a friend who was having a crumby time in the mountains, plain and simple. Think what you like !

 

[suzuki_ryder]

Not every kit is the same. Your basically saying a turbo is a turbo. Might as well say an 800 is an 800, no matter what brand. They should all make the exact same power right? They're 800's!

If that was the case, there would be no point of seeing so many different turbo kits available (MPI, MCX, Alpine, powder lites, boondocker). They're all different, and some are more efficient than others.

Another huge thing is set up. I've seen Darren's set up compare to a riverside set up sled, with the same turbo kit, totally destroy (5 lengths within 300') the riverside sled. And they were the exact same. The guy got Darren to re-do riversides install the best he could and couldn't believe the difference.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Summitboy]

I do believe there is some merit to that for sure. However i believe the MPI 180 kit uses a Mitsubishi 15G turbo which flows 10% less than a MCX 16T so in fact it would be less efficient. So if that is truely the case than the math does not work. Maybe i'm wrong !

 

[hornydevil]

I do believe there is some merit to that for sure. However i believe the MPI 180 kit uses a Mitsubishi 15G turbo which flows 10% less than a MCX 16T so in fact it would be less efficient. So if that is truely the case than the math does not work. Maybe i'm wrong !

Wy won't you give the man himself a call instead of asking everybody else on here for the info that your looking for??? He will be more than happy to answer anything you want to know and more.

 

[TABSTER]

I really like Hawkins Cheezies.

This is common knowledge.
It does not require any third party dyno tests or mathematical equations to prove credibility. Oh, yah almost forgot. I have a goldfish. Just thought i would throw that out there, seeing as we're talking about chit that is really irrelevant.

 

[tjc]

Just a thought, how about calling the person/party involved as you seem to be starving for information. Not sure what your trying to prove but it's starting to get annoying. You obviously have no interest in owning a mpi kit by what I have been reading. You seem to have a hard on for mcx and that's fine, but you don't seem to have any open forum edict as far as calling people or business out online from your staples office chair or the safety of your couch but really now.
We must be between season now as the keyboard pilots are starting to polute the forums again. Hurry up and melt snow so we can go fishing, camping and quading.
Just my opinion

I dont think he is talking up one or the other at all. It is simply a comparison of the two.

He is right boost is not a magical art, a stock engine can only handle so much. Why is it so wrong to ask for hard facts instead of simply accepting "oh it works so well". If that is you you need to know in order to buy something I will sell you some nice ocean front property in Kansas.

I dont see how someone could possibly buy something before knowing this information.

No knock to E&S I have seen some nice stuff online coming out of their shop. I have no experience first hand.

 

[TABSTER]

I dont think he is talking up one or the other at all. It is simply a comparison of the two.

He is right boost is not a magical art, a stock engine can only handle so much. Why is it so wrong to ask for hard facts instead of simply accepting "oh it works so well". If that is you you need to know in order to buy something I will sell you some nice ocean front property in Kansas.

I dont see how someone could possibly buy something before knowing this information.

No knock to E&S I have seen some nice stuff online coming out of their shop. I have no experience first hand.

Not arguing the math, facts, info, none of the above. My beef is the presentation, the way he went about it. Like many others said including Darren, "give him/me a call". It obviously isnt a real issue if a thread goes for a week and no phone calls are made. Just a bunch of bantering and speculation. Just my interpretation, it's to trash or bash not to resolve a customers Issue like stated earlier or to gain knowledge.

J.M.O.

 

[Summitboy]

I have talked to Darren. I know some of the numbers he has said about the original 180 kit. I know what he told our group in Revy. When I buy a car i don't take the salesman's word as fact either. I believe this thread was started to get information out to the people who want to buy this kit. People have asked questions like i have and received answers. I asked a couple questions as well. You just don't like the fact i'm looking at the numbers and you don't like what you hear. If it was something you liked to hear you wouldn't have a problem with it. Useless bantering and speculation ? There has been more useful info in this thread in the last 5 pages than the 10 before hand. Why do i need to call someone to get the answers when i can get them here in a thread about this kit ?

Tabster, the only useless banter has been from yourself. Your the one not offering anything credible to the thread. Your the one making the personal attacks. Take a second and look back through it !

 

[suzuki_ryder]

You've stated that you spoke to him, and you even just wrote that don't believe a word of what a salesmen tells you, as fact. So what is it your after?

Darren could write an explanation on here...but you won't believe it.

You could see facts...but not believe it

You copied MPI's facts...and don't believe it

The thing I believe is that you have keyboard courage. I bet you didn't say any of this to his face when he helped you in Revy did you? You waited days later for snow and mud.

If you don't like what Darren is offering, take your business elsewhere. Plain and simple no?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[TABSTER]

I have talked to Darren. I know some of the numbers he has said about the original 180 kit. I know what he told our group in Revy. When I buy a car i don't take the salesman's word as fact either. I believe this thread was started to get information out to the people who want to buy this kit. People have asked questions like i have and received answers. I asked a couple questions as well. You just don't like the fact i'm looking at the numbers and you don't like what you hear. If it was something you liked to hear you wouldn't have a problem with it. Useless bantering and speculation ? There has been more useful info in this thread in the last 5 pages than the 10 before hand. Why do i need to call someone to get the answers when i can get them here in a thread about this kit ?

Tabster, the only useless banter has been from yourself. Your the one not offering anything credible to the thread. Your the one making the personal attacks. Take a second and look back through it !

You just don't get it. And as far as contribution , I
have contributed to this site and others more than you will ever know!

 

[lilduke]

first off im not on one side or the other and have no interest in involving my self in a pissing match,,im just an outside observer of this thread. i personally ride a NA 2stroke but am interested in 4stroke turbos and one day i may just own one.

Im sure the kit in question works great and the vendor is an outstanding guy and a expert on turbo charging yamaha sleds..

that being said why doesnt he just answer the questions about the kit,,shut up summitboy and let all the prospective customers reading this thread, have the information that may help there buying decision a little easier...


just my 2cents carry on now

 

[TABSTER]

We assembled two 180 kits here the last couple months and run them at approx. 1000 to 1250 ft elevation. All is great, there was a hesitation but found we were reving to high. Installed dtya-2 weights in verses the stock 8FS loaded up with 17.2 steel rivots. Hesitation went away pulls really clean and hanging around 85 to 8600 rpm. Both sleds running 81 grams give or take.

 

[Summitboy]

Well, it doesn't seem to matter what i say. There has been no explanation to why the numbers don't work. I leave you with the maps and you can take away what i and others already know. It is too bad Snow and Mud cannot be used to get meaningful information. Too many brand loyalists and not enough reasonable individuals to promote real discussion.