Equipment that interferes with Transceivers

[~Rowdy~]

Had a transceiver search with some friends this weekend and we tested our transceivers with the below devices. ALL of them sent a false signal in close proximity. So if you carry any of the items below in your front pocket and you are searching there is a chance that they will send a false signal. We tested this on Tracker 1, 2 & 3 and Pieps transceivers. I was surprised at the results personally, and will be adjusting how I carry my equipment after trying this out. I will also be doing further testing on the equipment I carry in some different scenarios

• Spot
• Garmin 650
• BCA Link **only sent false signal from the unit, not the mic, so if the main unit in your pack you should be ok.
• Baofeng **only sent false signal from the unit, not the mic, so if the main unit in your pack you should be ok.
• Cell phone on and in airplane mode
• Sat Phone

 

[bayman]

Had a transceiver search with some friends this weekend and we tested our transceivers with the below devices. ALL of them sent a false signal in close proximity. So if you carry any of the items below in your front pocket and you are searching there is a chance that they will send a false signal. We tested this on Tracker 1, 2 & 3 and Pieps transceivers. I was surprised at the results personally, and will be adjusting how I carry my equipment after trying this out. I will also be doing further testing on the equipment I carry in some different scenarios

• Spot
• Garmin 650
• BCA Link **only sent false signal from the unit, not the mic, so if the main unit in your pack you should be ok.
• Baofeng **only sent false signal from the unit, not the mic, so if the main unit in your pack you should be ok.
• Cell phone on and in airplane mode
• Sat Phone

Was hoping to make it out with you guys, damn work got in the way. May have to re-adjust where I carry my phone and spot going forward though.

 

[etecheaven]

Had a transceiver search with some friends this weekend and we tested our transceivers with the below devices. ALL of them sent a false signal in close proximity. So if you carry any of the items below in your front pocket and you are searching there is a chance that they will send a false signal. We tested this on Tracker 1, 2 & 3 and Pieps transceivers. I was surprised at the results personally, and will be adjusting how I carry my equipment after trying this out. I will also be doing further testing on the equipment I carry in some different scenarios

• Spot
• Garmin 650
• BCA Link **only sent false signal from the unit, not the mic, so if the main unit in your pack you should be ok.
• Baofeng **only sent false signal from the unit, not the mic, so if the main unit in your pack you should be ok.
• Cell phone on and in airplane mode
• Sat Phone

Thank you for doing this, i would never have thought my cell phone is airplane mode would cause a problem. I keep it in my front pocket for pictures and to keep it warm.... but will not any longer.

How close where you when you did the test?

This only affects the searching beacon not the receiving? did you test both?

 

[~Rowdy~]

Thank you for doing this, i would never have thought my cell phone is airplane mode would cause a problem. I keep it in my front pocket for pictures and to keep it warm.... but will not any longer.

How close where you when you did the test?

This only affects the searching beacon not the receiving? did you test both?

We had to be very close for all transceivers and we only tested in searching. I did not run a test with a transceiver in transmit. I'd like to do more tests like I said, our focus was more on practicing our single and multiple searches in single and group scenarios. It was just something I wanted to test quickly. Probably a good idea for everyone try it for themselves and in as many different scenarios as possible. I just figured if I threw up what we saw maybe it might spark other people to try for themselves. Once I have a chance to run some more tests I'll throw up some more detailed descriptions.

 

[~Rowdy~]

Was hoping to make it out with you guys, damn work got in the way. May have to re-adjust where I carry my phone and spot going forward though.

Yeah I heard! I suggested we do another one for you and the Olers as none of you made it. Just do it down south this time with a smaller group. I'd like to get some more practicing and testing in this season. Start another chat on FB and we can get another one organized!

 

[bayman]

Absolutely, I know Ma and Pa Oler are on a plane and should be back tomorrow. Chris is up to his eyeballs in fabrication, I stopped in there late on Saturday afternoon for a look. Had all intentions of going, but that damned ring road project is a huge pain in my butt. I saw the picture on fb, most of the usual suspects were there with the exception of us 4 as mentioned, that was good to see. Sorry I missed it and another opportunity to practice would be awesome! I have been showing my kids a little, but getting out with the guy/gals I ride with is way better, feels a little securer knowing peeps know how find you in the unfortunate case of a burial. Thanks again for doing that.

 

[JMCX]

Thanks again to Rowdy for organizing.

Just to clarify. What we observed was that you as a searcher better not have any other powered electronics on your person while searching. My Baofeng didn't seem to cause any problem with the radio in the pack and mic over the shoulder but probably still best to power down in a search situation.

I will probably continue to carry my phone as l always have but got to be super aware, if the time comes, it has to be left behind or powered down.

 

[bayman]

Thanks again to Rowdy for organizing.

Just to clarify. What we observed was that you as a searcher better not have any other powered electronics on your person while searching. My Baofeng didn't seem to cause any problem with the radio in the pack and mic over the shoulder but probably still best to power down in a search situation.

I will probably continue to carry my phone as l always have but got to be super aware, if the time comes, it has to be left behind or powered down.

I carry my spot in my vest pocket opposite of the beacon...should I look and moving it I wonder? I know yours is in your backpack. Sorry I missed this little exercise, some good questions sourced from this.

 

[Bnorth]

This transceiver interference is getting more and more documented, thanks for that. The only electronics I keep on my person now are my beacon in my vest pocket and radio in the back goggle compartment with mic on my shoulder. This doesn't seem to interfere in searches at all. I keep my phone and inReach in the glove compartment of my sled and started this a few years ago when we started hearing about interference.

 

[JMCX]

I carry my spot in my vest pocket opposite of the beacon...should I look and moving it I wonder? I know yours is in your backpack. Sorry I missed this little exercise, some good questions sourced from this.

There's so many scenarios. Too bad it was such a cold day, we might have done more experimenting. All l can say for sure right now is if you have to flip into search you better not have anything else powered on your body. More than 3 feet away seemed to be fine.

 

[Teth-Air]

Had a transceiver search with some friends this weekend and we tested our transceivers with the below devices. ALL of them sent a false signal in close proximity. So if you carry any of the items below in your front pocket and you are searching there is a chance that they will send a false signal. We tested this on Tracker 1, 2 & 3 and Pieps transceivers. I was surprised at the results personally, and will be adjusting how I carry my equipment after trying this out. I will also be doing further testing on the equipment I carry in some different scenarios

• Spot
• Garmin 650
• BCA Link **only sent false signal from the unit, not the mic, so if the main unit in your pack you should be ok.
• Baofeng **only sent false signal from the unit, not the mic, so if the main unit in your pack you should be ok.
• Cell phone on and in airplane mode
• Sat Phone

Please do not get confused with search and transmit modes when you discuss Rowdy's findings here. There are a ton of guys that believe that if they get buried their beacons may not work to transmit because they have other electronics on them. It must be noted and understood that it is the searcher more than the victim that may be effected. For this reason it is good practice to hold your beacon far out in front of you when searching so nothing on your body influences the sensitive search mode. Yes some will argue that it could hurt the transmit function too but just the same, it is possible that the victim could be found easier because of the electronics he is carrying too. Every single post like Rowdy's always gets a response that interprets the finding incorrectly.

Thank you for doing this testing!

 

[~Rowdy~]

Thanks again to Rowdy for organizing.

Just to clarify. What we observed was that you as a searcher better not have any other powered electronics on your person while searching. My Baofeng didn't seem to cause any problem with the radio in the pack and mic over the shoulder but probably still best to power down in a search situation.

I will probably continue to carry my phone as l always have but got to be super aware, if the time comes, it has to be left behind or powered down.

Thanks for clarifying James.

I carry my spot in my vest pocket opposite of the beacon...should I look and moving it I wonder? I know yours is in your backpack. Sorry I missed this little exercise, some good questions sourced from this.

I probably would. We could do some more testing to that effect.

Please do not get confused with search and transmit modes when you discuss Rowdy's findings here. There are a ton of guys that believe that if they get buried their beacons may not work to transmit because they have other electronics on them. It must be noted and understood that it is the searcher more than the victim that may be effected. For this reason it is good practice to hold your beacon far out in front of you when searching so nothing on your body influences the sensitive search mode. Yes some will argue that it could hurt the transmit function too but just the same, it is possible that the victim could be found easier because of the electronics he is carrying too. Every single post like Rowdy's always gets a response that interprets the finding incorrectly.

Thank you for doing this testing!

Thank you!. I'm looking forward to doing some more testing on this as I was quite surprised with some of the items causing a false signal while in search function.

 

[~Rowdy~]

Please do not get confused with search and transmit modes when you discuss Rowdy's findings here. There are a ton of guys that believe that if they get buried their beacons may not work to transmit because they have other electronics on them. It must be noted and understood that it is the searcher more than the victim that may be effected. For this reason it is good practice to hold your beacon far out in front of you when searching so nothing on your body influences the sensitive search mode. Yes some will argue that it could hurt the transmit function too but just the same, it is possible that the victim could be found easier because of the electronics he is carrying too. Every single post like Rowdy's always gets a response that interprets the finding incorrectly.

Thank you for doing this testing!

Just another note to what you are saying here, if I do some more extensive testing I will be sure to put as much accurate information as possible and take pictures or videos.

This was a very quick test with each of the items described. It was only out of curiosity that we even tried it. Everyone took a turn turning their transceiver on, then into search mode and getting close to the item at which point it would throw a false signal. That false signal ranged in numbers as well, the numbers it submitted as a false signal weren't accurate to the location of the item throwing the false signal. Clear as mud? lol. If you are curious or question these results at all I urge you to try it for yourselves.

 

[LID]

Think I posted these a few years back, false signal when searching next to the garmin, when garmin was on. No effect when garmin was off

I had also heard a few years ago 3rd hand, that during testing, placing a phone on top of a transmitting beacon reduced the max range that signal could be found

 

[RGM]

Just another note to what you are saying here, if I do some more extensive testing I will be sure to put as much accurate information as possible and take pictures or videos.

This was a very quick test with each of the items described. It was only out of curiosity that we even tried it. Everyone took a turn turning their transceiver on, then into search mode and getting close to the item at which point it would throw a false signal. That false signal ranged in numbers as well, the numbers it submitted as a false signal weren't accurate to the location of the item throwing the false signal. Clear as mud? lol. If you are curious or question these results at all I urge you to try it for yourselves.

to do a proper test you need to find out how far away the device has to be to have no effect. 30 cm is usually more than enough. Also a running sled can throw out false signals, so if you are covering a large slide using your sled you need to shut it off when checking.

 

[scotts]

We,(007) found similar results with the Garmin during field training!
Just shows the importance of routine practice! Once you and your crew are very familiar with your equipment, you will begin to notice the drawbacks or glitches with the stuff you have! Without consistent repeated use you won't find the problems until they show up in an emergency!

 

[Snort]

We have done testing in the past with a phone and a transmitting beacon. We placed the beacon by itself and then did a search for it. We then placed an iphone (on and not in airplane mode) right with it and performed the same search. We found that there was noticeable difference. We tried this several times with the same result. This was with only one type of device. We may try the same thing a GPS, radio, etc in the future.

 

[whoDEANie]

We have done testing in the past with a phone and a transmitting beacon. We placed the beacon by itself and then did a search for it. We then placed an iphone (on and not in airplane mode) right with it and performed the same search. We found that there was noticeable difference. We tried this several times with the same result. This was with only one type of device. We may try the same thing a GPS, radio, etc in the future.

I'd be curious to see the results with the phone in Airplane mode.

 

[tstams]

Can do it at my house if you would like

 

[amber]

Great you guys are getting to know your stuff!
There are some great research articles on transceiver interference...
http://arc.lib.montana.edu/snow-science/item.php?id=1863 then Get Full Article by Genswein
Some Basics at:
https://www.avalanche.ca/news/transceiver-interference
http://beaconreviews.com/transceivers/interference.asp

Let us know if you have any questions!

LET IT SNOW! :d