Electric vehicles

[LennyR]

It's easier to build transmission lines than pipelines. 33 kWh of battery is the equivalent energy of 1 gallon of gasoline (in watt hours). Lets say you have 100kWh battery and 500km of range. This would be compared to an ICE vehicle doing 500km with 11.4 litres of fuel.

If you install solar panels and use the energy you generate to charge a vehicle (displacing gasoline) that will be the quickest way to pay off your system.

Or you can do seismic to figure out where oil is located. Get permission from land owners/mineral rights. Set up a rig and drill. Build a site with holding tanks. Haul Oil with Super B to refinery. Refine the oil. Transport fuel by pipeline. Haul fuel to gas station. Drive to the gas station to fill up.

Just go go to the store and buy those batteries that will need replacing (in 8 years ?????) that just magically appear on the shelf with no impact to the environment, and when they need replacing just take them to the battery fairy and poof they're new again , again with no negative impact , if a few million of them are beyond rebuilding, We can just stack them somewhere (forever) and build more , from the huge mines that are almost 0 in their carbon footprint. Be interesting to calculate how many more mines were gonna need , like right now, if even 50 % of the ic vehicle owners decided to go electric this year. Interesting how much impact the construction of enough plug ins to satisfy all these new users, how many of the users would still have on board an ic engine to supplement ( which to me is a partial step in the plan) . And how many years till the payback actually gets anywhere close to zero, in a country or even a continent that is such a minimal contributor to emissions relative to the world.
Yeah , it would be easier , cleaner , quieter , maybe even better to use electric engines for everything , but essentially mining for components for batteries is not really a lot different than mining for oil in my mind, just a different process. And I can't help but think about my golf carts I have scattered around at different places , 2 of them are electric one is gas, and as much as I keep them well maintained, I've had substantially more issues and pita factors with the electric than the gas, that my experience anyway.
Not an expert by any means , but seems to me there's a huge hill to climb and gotta wonder if this is gonna turn out like the wind farms in Germany and so many other places. Maybe , just maybe the efforts to create cleaner more efficient ic motors is enough to get to the same impact on carbon footprint . Maybe causing a total change to electric vehicles with all thats needed to be built and modified and maintained will cause such an impact the on the environment that it'll be a thousand years to get to zero !! While the oil and NG sits and oozes out of places like the oil sands and we just pile all the rigs, equipment , tanks, trucks, ic motors , which we've worked very hard and continue to strive to be cleaner and more efficient, we can just put them on shelves somewhere to rust away for the next thousand years or so.
As I said , I realize there's a lot I don't know , but the greenies are the groovy folks lately, and they're on a mission , but seems to me we've been led down the path a few times lately with other issues, best be careful before jumping blindly into this pool .

 

[lilduke]

Oxygen a not a pollutant either but it does become a problem if there is too much of it in your atmosphere. Think Apollo program fire. It also causes premature rusting of many metals and corrosion in others as an example.

I don't know to what degree the rising CO2 levels will affect our weather but it is already affecting our oceans by making them more acidic. Wonder how mankind will do if there are no more fish to eat.

But no, despite some of the pretty obvious signs being pointed out, it is much easier to sit back and do nothing or promote no change in what we do. It took a long time for people in the middle ages to accept the world was no flat, that it revolved around the sun and not the other way around etc. so I imagine there will be a percentage of the current inhabitants of earth that will not recognize the problem until it is too late.

As to the cost of switching over to cleaner sources of power, all the new installations are good for employment and the economy in general just like there was no oil economy before the ICE. The changes are coming whether we like it or not.

Who the hell wants to eat a radio active fukushima fish anyways? Or how about a crude oil flavored gulf cod?
How much change in PH is all this carbon causing anyways? Least of our worries Id bet as the levels are still way lower
then they were 150 million years ago during the jurassic period. Well at least that is what they tell us, but I'm still not convinced the earth isn't 6000years old and flat..lol

 

[X-it]

The tesla i was in got up to 120k in about 4-5 seconds ...just a guess though. I am not sure it would recharge in 40 minutes though.

 

[eclipse1966]

coincidently, I watched a program last night and the next energy source they predict will come from nuclear fusion. Pretty cool stuff and we are not far from making it happen from what they said on the program.

buy uranium stocks
nuclear power will be the next big thing

 

[ducati]

I wouldn’t be too embarrassed getting beat by a Tesla sedan in a drag race.

You could run the Demon down the track multiple times before the Tesla even gets enough heat in the battery to do a ludicrous mode launch, the price difference in MSRP between the two is over $70,000 CAD and Tesla will remove the ludicrous mode from the cad if you use it too many times as it over stresses some components of the drivetrain when used repeatedly.

The acceleration of the Tesla is absolutely impressive, no doubt about that, it just doesn’t come without some terms and conditions.

 

[Cdnfireman]

It's easier to build transmission lines than pipelines. 33 kWh of battery is the equivalent energy of 1 gallon of gasoline (in watt hours). Lets say you have 100kWh battery and 500km of range. This would be compared to an ICE vehicle doing 500km with 11.4 litres of fuel.

If you install solar panels and use the energy you generate to charge a vehicle (displacing gasoline) that will be the quickest way to pay off your system.

Or you can do seismic to figure out where oil is located. Get permission from land owners/mineral rights. Set up a rig and drill. Build a site with holding tanks. Haul Oil with Super B to refinery. Refine the oil. Transport fuel by pipeline. Haul fuel to gas station. Drive to the gas station to fill up.

The transmission lines need devices at the end of them to produce electricity. They’re called generators, and need prime movers to spin them, and they either burn fossil fuels or require a dam that took several thousand tons of diesel fuel to build. That’s the problem with electric car advocates, they think the electricity at the plug in just magically appears and has no negative effect on the environment.
Electric vehicles, like most of the green energy movement are feel good enterprises that exist only because they are heavily subsidized by tax dollars. Left to the free market, the green energy movement would cease to exist.
The only way electric vehicles will become anything other than a sidebar of transportation is if the technologies of cold fusion or ambient temperature superconductivity are perfected and become mainstream. Converting electricity into electrochemical energy then back to electricity via a battery is inefficient and never going to provide the energy density required for any vehicle other than a small commuter vehicle. The laws of physics make storage of electricity for anything other than a small amount temporarily nearly impossible.
Manufacturers should concentrate on making commuter systems (small autonomous cars, busses, LRT systems etc) currently and once technology has advanced enough to provide power output high enough for larger vehicles then they can start building electric pickups, semi trailers etc.

 

[X-it]

17 kw total power from the windmills today and zero from the solar farms... the greenies answer to our problems. I wonder what it cost to build all those white elephants that have a 20 year shelf life?

 

[Cdnfireman]

17 kw total power from the windmills today and zero from the solar farms... the greenies answer to our problems. I wonder what it cost to build all those white elephants that have a 20 year shelf life?

Cost is irrelevant. What feels good is all that matters.

 

[Couch]

I would not have thought that an electric motor and batteries is lighter than a gas motor and fuel tank full.
Carbon foot print to build battery, from the mine to the car is??
Also how efficient is the power transfer to the battery and what is the total carbon footprint of the power generating system.
Solar wind or hydro?
All these systems have a life cycle and large carbon foot print to get operational and then maintain.
People do not look at what it actually takes to get that clean power transfered into the car battery.
Is it a 15% efficient system?

The plugging in part is clean.....getting there is far from as clean as promoted.
Oh ya you can't mention that.

You really want to go with the total carbon footprint argument???
The main hold up is battery storage capacity. Writing is on the wall for oil in the mid to long term ....look at where the auto industry is heading ...
Me, I'm just waiting for Doc to get the flux capacitor figured out .....

 

[X-it]

https://principia-scientific.org/st...ses-as-much-co2-as-8-years-of-driving-on-gas/

 

[jhurkot]

Cost is irrelevant. What feels good is all that matters.

Drive 500km for $20 electricity
Drive 500km for $40 gasoline

Explain to me how your way is better.

 

[Lund]

You really want to go with the total carbon footprint argument???
The main hold up is battery storage capacity. Writing is on the wall for oil in the mid to long term ....look at where the auto industry is heading ...
Me, I'm just waiting for Doc to get the flux capacitor figured out .....

The world is changing, some will accept it, some won't. Either way you can not stop it what ever your view is about it. We are all going to be replaced by the new generation's and our idea's of what should be will die with us, while the new will continue to change society.
Its not a bad thing but it does effect the lives of many, some for the bad and some for the good.

Me, i'm pumped at driving a Tesla for a week, even if i end up not going the rout of an EV.

 

[DaveB]

Drive 500km for $20 electricity
Drive 500km for $40 gasoline

Explain to me how your way is better.

When the gov't figures out that yer saving money, the cost of electricity will triple. EI: Ontario.Then it will cost more to drive your e-car 150 km....plus the cost to keep your lights on at home will triple.

Plus there's the whole drive 500 km thing....the E budget will have to be split into 4 days if its cold outside....3 days if its warm out.....

 

[Cdnfireman]

Drive 500km for $20 electricity
Drive 500km for $40 gasoline

Explain to me how your way is better.

Factor in your lost productivity for the 2 days it takes you to drive the 500 km. And if that’s not a concern for you and you’re a true progressive, environment loving, tofu slurping man-bun toter, you’d do the 500 km in 10 days on the back of a donkey and feel oh so special......

 

[skegpro]

coincidently, I watched a program last night and the next energy source they predict will come from nuclear fusion. Pretty cool stuff and we are not far from making it happen from what they said on the program.

I remember a time when Bruce power wanted to put a Nuclear plant in Peace River ...... Would be nice to have that right about now.

 

[ABMax24]

Drive 500km for $20 electricity
Drive 500km for $40 gasoline

Explain to me how your way is better.

It's definitely hard to argue the efficiency of an electric vehicle. Due to high efficient appliances and using natural gas instead of electric for heating we use on average 220 kwh of electricity every month, the average Alberta home uses about 600 kwh. With that
extra 380 kwh of electricity we could power a Tesla model 3 over 2000km every month.

We could literally use the same amount of electricity as the average household and not burn a drop of fossil fuels to commute to and from work.

BTW we on average use 60 GJ of natural gas a year, the average Alberta household uses 120 GJ.

Efficiency really isn't that hard if you want to make a small effort, and we still live a life better than most.

 

[takethebounce]

It's definitely hard to argue the efficiency of an electric vehicle. Due to high efficient appliances and using natural gas instead of electric for heating we use on average 220 kwh of electricity every month, the average Alberta home uses about 600 kwh. With that
extra 380 kwh of electricity we could power a Tesla model 3 over 2000km every month.

We could literally use the same amount of electricity as the average household and not burn a drop of fossil fuels to commute to and from work.

BTW we on average use 60 GJ of natural gas a year, the average Alberta household uses 120 GJ.

Efficiency really isn't that hard if you want to make a small effort, and we still live a life better than most.

Clearly we are going back into an Ice age, who cares about climate change. Burn all the fuel you want.

Using the 60 GJ of natural gas isn't the costly part, its the transmission and distributions costs for gas/elec that are going to continue to rise as the infrastructure needed to support all this green energy isn't in place to handle the future demands.

 

[ABMax24]

Clearly we are going back into an Ice age, who cares about climate change. Burn all the fuel you want.

Using the 60 GJ of natural gas isn't the costly part, its the transmission and distributions costs for gas/elec that are going to continue to rise as the infrastructure needed to support all this green energy isn't in place to handle the future demands.

There are fixed distribution costs and variable ones, your distribution fees go up when you consume more. For instance electricity is about 6c/kwh, but it costs another 10c to have that electricity delivered. It definitely pays to use less.

Quite frankly I could care less how much fuel anyone burns, I choose to use less because it costs me less. And if rates do go up in the future because of changing sources of energy I will already be ahead, because a large portion of that cost will be based on consumption.

 

[lilduke]

**** it cant build pipe lines any ways, lets build some power lines then. If every ones making lots of money, paying double on your power bill won't be a big issue.

Keep that iron turning!

 

[skegpro]

**** it cant build pipe lines any ways, lets build some power lines then. If every ones making lots of money, paying double on your power bill won't be a big issue.

Keep that iron turning!

Yay!

Then we can buy power from the USA to pump into these fancy new lines.

Man Berta is awesome.