Trail question

[skegpro]

What if you wrote the government a letter saying your OHV is confused and doesn't want to identify itself as a snow vehicle or an atv? We can have trail neutral signs made up no big bad club bullies saying sleds only.....

I think I could probably get JT on board with that lol. Think of the funding Kaz dog would have then lol.

 

[SHREK1]

Great debate guys, pretty clear who the winner was

 

[Kaz Dog]

Great debate guys, pretty clear who the winner was

Yes, thanks.

 

[rebel]

Great debate guys, pretty clear who the winner was

Who won?

 

[LBZ]

So funny story, talking with a warden at the Bragg Creek ranger station today.
1-403-949-5941

He agreed with me 100% that an atv with tracks would be considered a snow vechile and there would be absolutely nothing he could charge me with.......

He said and I quote, " snowmobiles only is the preference of the club"

He said its about being considerate and not damaging the trails, which in 100% agree with.

Oh and I pay trail fees, memberships, donate, participate in clean ups.
Pails in comparison but you have obviously contributed to society more than anyone else, ever.

And this 100% I can understand and should make sense to all.

It's pretty simple really. No tires on the trails in the winter.

A few F off big signs stating this and good to go. FWIW the people that are gonna put tires on trails will do so regardless what the laws or signage is in place and they ain't paying either.

So instead of painting all SxS and atv tracked folk with the same brush how about give it a chance to draw more membership and funding for the club's by allowing them. As said some clubs say snowbikes are ok so wtf is the problem then??

It's obviously not a legal one......

 

[skegpro]

And this 100% I can understand and should make sense to all.

It's pretty simple really. No tires on the trails in the winter.

A few F off big signs stating this and good to go. FWIW the people that are gonna put tires on trails will do so regardless what the laws or signage is in place and they ain't paying either.

So instead of painting all SxS and atv tracked folk with the same brush how about give it a chance to draw more membership and funding for the club's by allowing them. As said some clubs say snowbikes are ok so wtf is the problem then??

It's obviously not a legal one......

Well now that's just plain logical.

 

[skegpro]

Yes, thanks.

Care to point out the TSN turning point?

I am still concerned you haven't comprehended anything anyone has pointed out here.........

Blink twice if you atleast acknowledge it.

 

[skegpro]

problem is Mikey, person a with ATV on tracks tours the trails, responsibly does no damage, person B see ATV on trails, and takes ATV not on tracks on tour, makes a huge mess, digs holes, and ruins a groom...... now the VOLUNTEER organizations have to go back out and spend many hours and burn up more diesel to try to repair the damages.......

ATV on tracks may not do damage to the trails, however, ALL SNOWMOBILE CLUBS post NO ATV signs on their trails for the reasoning above.

So crazy question.
Do you think you could somehow convey that message with signage rather than discourageing the OP from enjoying the trail?

 

[TylerG]

So crazy question.
Do you think you could somehow convey that message with signage rather than discourageing the OP from enjoying the trail?

Honestly, it has been tried time and time again..... People in society today are far too entitled and lack the respect to obey said signage

 

[skegpro]

Honestly, it has been tried time and time again..... People in society today are far too entitled and lack the respect to obey said signage

Conservation officer said there is fines for damaging the trail. Sounded like he liked handing out tickets.

Plus it's in a park, he could probably nail them to a cross.

Let him do his job?

 

[zal]

So funny story, talking with a warden at the Bragg Creek ranger station today.
1-403-949-5941

He agreed with me 100% that an atv with tracks would be considered a snow vechile and there would be absolutely nothing he could charge me with.......

He said and I quote, " snowmobiles only is the preference of the club"

He said its about being considerate and not damaging the trails, which in 100% agree with.

Oh and I pay trail fees, memberships, donate, participate in clean ups.
Pails in comparison but you have obviously contributed to society more than anyone else, ever.

It is a preference of the club, yes. It is also the preference to Alberta Snowmobile Association, who is the governed body of any ASA trail in Alberta. Their decisions are based on a few factors. One, whats best for the club and the people who use the trails. Two, the legality aspect of it. Through ASA, every club, its trails, the volunteers, the paid members, the directors and the executives are covered under said insurance. This insurance covers the above if it involves Snowmobiles. Reason being, low ground pressure, less damaging compared to wheeled OHV. With times changing and machines changing, yes I will agree, there should be a change. It is a very gray area. If you want to fight it or get a clarification, call the ASA in Edmonton. Then maybe it will be brought up with the insurances, the association (which it has been many many many times) and looked into more. Please don't expect it to change over night.

It is true what Tyler said. You let track machines on, you will find wheeled machines on too. Until people learn to respect the trails and understand the consequences, time and money that goes into the trails, it unfortunately puts every quad, side x side and UTV in the same boat. Tracks or not.

But for now, on the trails of Peace Valley SnoRiders, please respect our wishes as a club/volunteers and no tracked or wheeled OHV on our trails. Not only does it make repairing the trails easier, but it also protects(covers) us as a club.

Tim

 

[skegpro]

It is a preference of the club, yes. It is also the preference to Alberta Snowmobile Association, who is the governed body of any ASA trail in Alberta. Their decisions are based on a few factors. One, whats best for the club and the people who use the trails. Two, the legality aspect of it. Through ASA, every club, its trails, the volunteers, the paid members, the directors and the executives are covered under said insurance. This insurance covers the above if it involves Snowmobiles. Reason being, low ground pressure, less damaging compared to wheeled OHV. With times changing and machines changing, yes I will agree, there should be a change. It is a very gray area. If you want to fight it or get a clarification, call the ASA in Edmonton. Then maybe it will be brought up with the insurances, the association (which it has been many many many times) and looked into more. Please don't expect it to change over night.

It is true what Tyler said. You let track machines on, you will find wheeled machines on too. Until people learn to respect the trails and understand the consequences, time and money that goes into the trails, it unfortunately puts every quad, side x side and UTV in the same boat. Tracks or not.

But for now, on the trails of Peace Valley SnoRiders, please respect our wishes as a club/volunteers and no tracked or wheeled OHV on our trails. Not only does it make repairing the trails easier, but it also protects(covers) us as a club.

Tim

Hey that is the peace regions decision and I respect your stance.

With regards to Cataract Creek.

I did call the ASA and the person I talked to was unsure about the definition of the term "Snow Vechile" and was unsure of what was allowed on the Cataract Creek trail. So he referred me directly to, and I quote "the person who writes the tickets".

As far as insurance, they will be happy to admend the policy or sell you more insurance if need be. But the policy should be written for snow vechiles imo or you are leaving yourselves open to a lawsuit as the trail is rated for "snow vechiles".

This sounds like more of an education problem than anything.

Tracks = Good

Tires + Snow = Bad

 

[rsaruk]

Can I take this on the trails? The ad says it's a snow vehicle.

 

[whoDEANie]

Hey that is the peace regions decision and I respect your stance.

With regards to Cataract Creek.

I did call the ASA and the person I talked to was unsure about the definition of the term "Snow Vechile" and was unsure of what was allowed on the Cataract Creek trail. So he referred me directly to, and I quote "the person who writes the tickets".

As far as insurance, they will be happy to admend the policy or sell you more insurance if need be. But the policy should be written for snow vechiles imo or you are leaving yourselves open to a lawsuit as the trail is rated for "snow vechiles".

This sounds like more of an education problem than anything.

Tracks = Good

Tires + Snow = Bad

Funny, I contacted SRD when a nearly identical thread came up a couple years back.

Dear Sir/Madame,

Recently there has been some on-line debate about OHV use at Cataract Creek. While it is obvious that rubber tired ATV’s are not permitted in this FLUZ at any time, there is some question about tracked ATV’s on these trails during the snowmobile season. Since tracked ATV’s actually have a larger footprint than snowmobiles, they are generally even easier on the groomed trails than the snowmobiles are.

Can a tracked ATV be considered a snow machine with respect to PLUZ access rules? If not, is there a reason that you might be willing to disclose? Of course, justification is not necessary, but it might help us put some debate to rest and/or curb illegal use.


Thanks in advance,

Hi Dean

Thanks for your email asking for clarification on the use of tracked ATV’s within the Cataract Creek PLUZ.

The Cataract Creek PLUZ trails were specifically designed for the use of snow machines. The trails are designated for ‘Snow Vehicles’ which are motor vehicles that are specifically designed and equipped to be driven exclusively on snow and ice. An OHV is described as a motor vehicle used for cross country travel on land, water, snow, ice, marsh, swamp or other natural terrain. Although you can make an OHV travel in snow, it is still an OHV and not considered a snow vehicle. Under the Public Lands Administration Regulations a person could be charged for taking an OHV into a designated Snow Vehicle area.

Hopefully this helps to clarify the approved designated trail use within the Cataract Creek PLUZ and put to rest some of the on line debate and potential illegal use.

Please don’t hesitate to contact me if you have any further questions.

Sincerely,

Land Management Specialist
Environment & Sustainable Resource Development
South Saskatchewan Region

 

[skegpro]

Funny, I contacted SRD when a nearly identical thread came up a couple years back.

Well at least everyone is extremely consistent. Lol

I notice that they conviently left out the term cheifly which makes a difference IMO.

I wonder if anyone with a snowbike has been ticketed or had to go to court?

 

[TylerG]

Well at least everyone is extremely consistent. Lol

I notice that they conviently left out the term cheifly which makes a difference IMO.

I wonder if anyone with a snowbike has been ticketed or had to go to court?

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from what I've heard from the volunteers that maintain the area, they don't see many snowbikes as snowbikes don't really seem to like the groomed trails as much. You can get over the top of Cataract and into Fording Pass, so all Snowbikes take a direct route back to there.

The other thing to remember, Arctic Cat is bringing a FACTORY purpose built snowbike to the market, that's where they will be more "accepted' in the common place.

I guess the other question would be to groups like SledRevelstoke, or VARDA, what are their thoughts on ATV's or UTV's with tracks on their groomed trails?

 

[skegpro]

from what I've heard from the volunteers that maintain the area, they don't see many snowbikes as snowbikes don't really seem to like the groomed trails as much. You can get over the top of Cataract and into Fording Pass, so all Snowbikes take a direct route back to there.

The other thing to remember, Arctic Cat is bringing a FACTORY purpose built snowbike to the market, that's where they will be more "accepted' in the common place.

I guess the other question would be to groups like SledRevelstoke, or VARDA, what are their thoughts on ATV's or UTV's with tracks on their groomed trails?

Wonder if someone not tuned into the industry like a guy with a ticket book will know the difference between a factory snowbike or an aftermarket one.......

 

[Tchetek]

I guess the other question would be to groups like SledRevelstoke, or VARDA, what are their thoughts on ATV's or UTV's with tracks on their groomed trails?

SAR used a side by side with tracks to recover the 2 lost sledders in revlestolk.


It would be really great to use a 4 seater with tracks at crystal ridge in valemont!

 

[TylerG]

SAR used a side by side with tracks to recover the 2 lost sledders in revlestolk.


It would be really great to use a 4 seater with tracks at crystal ridge in valemont!

SAR is a whole other story than "Joe SXS Operator"

 

[Ronaha]

I have quads and sleds so I'm not biased, but one crappy thing I can think of is tracked ATV is way slower then a sledder braaaapn down the trail,I know there's speed limits blah bla..and I can see Kaz and Glen not wanting them there.