So when will the Keystone XL pipeline will be approved?

[steveo10]

in the words of imdoo'n...... friggin treehuggers!

 

[imdoo'n]

hope it doesn't go, we can then process the oil here. why send it to texas and pay 10 times what it cost them to buy it in the first place. make the final product here.

 

[steveo10]

in a perfect world thats what i would like too. build the refinerys up here

 

[rubirose]

hope it doesn't go, we can then process the oil here. why send it to texas and pay 10 times what it cost them to buy it in the first place. make the final product here.

I agree, refine the oil here. Less environmental risk, and would create more jobs for Albertan's and fellow Canadian's.

 

[mathrulz]

Lots of the existing refineries along the gulf coast in Texas are barely running at half capacity. The infrastructure is already there. Alberta is getting new upgraders and refineries as we speak too - Voyageur, Fort Hills, North West, etc. Companies such as Cenovus have joint ventures in place with refining companies to process and refine their oil already. They expect to largely increase production volumes within the next 10 years and those joint ventures will still be there - the extra volumes have to be able to get to the refineries in the states (in Cenovus's case it is Connoco owned refineries).

Alberta will still get lots of jobs either way. If the Keystone pipeline doesn't go ahead Enbridge will probably just speed up plans to build theirs to the west coast anyway. Maybe that would satisfy the tree-hugers though. Transport the oil across the oceans where it is nearly impossible to fully contain and clean up an oil spill. And then the states will be forced to buy more oil from the terrorists where in some places they transport the oil through river beds instead of inside steel pipelines!

I'm not overly excited to see our natural resources being "bought-up" by other countries either, but unfortunately it's the only way for the oil companies to be able to compete globally and raise the capital to continue the growth and job creation here at home. My .

 

[Riverjet]

It's not about jobs. It's about profits for the corporations. Sending raw resources to other countries instead of having them processed here is in the best interests of business. In BC we export raw logs to Asia by the ship load. Our gov'ts are in bed with business, thus our jobs go offshore.

 

[ferniesnow]

and as a shareholder I want a return on my investment. If it is too expensive to doo business in North America the corporations look elsewhere. It is a vicious circle with wages and demands from labor as well as shareholders. I'll get taken over the coals but the unions have generally out grown the global economy and should sit back and re-evalutate the way they are going.

I too would like to see more processing in Canada but if we can't compete.....

 

[Summiteer]

It's not about jobs. It's about profits for the corporations. Sending raw resources to other countries instead of having them processed here is in the best interests of business. In BC we export raw logs to Asia by the ship load. Our gov'ts are in bed with business, thus our jobs go offshore.

edited. why TF can't I delete my post?

 

[imdoo'n]

that job has gone offshore so snow and mud can compete with chinese imports. hehe

 

[kellyandhislimo]

When i saw something about imdooin I thought this thread was going to be about keystone beer being pipelined just east of red deer.

 

[imdoo'n]

When i saw something about imdooin I thought this thread was going to be about keystone beer being pipelined just east of red deer.

now we're friggin talkin.

 

[frock]

and as a shareholder I want a return on my investment. If it is too expensive to doo business in North America the corporations look elsewhere. It is a vicious circle with wages and demands from labor as well as shareholders. I'll get taken over the coals but the unions have generally out grown the global economy and should sit back and re-evalutate the way they are going.

I too would like to see more processing in Canada but if we can't compete.....

Why can't we compete?????????????? I don't think it's a case of "can't compete". I think it's a case of us not getting the chance to compete because the States is looking after their own interests and, as usual, our government is more than willing to help them at this even if it costs Canadian jobs. Our government rarely stands up to the states even if they are in the right; remember the softwood lumber dispute(s).

 

[eclipse1966]

Why can't we compete?????????????? I don't think it's a case of "can't compete". I think it's a case of us not getting the chance to compete because the States is looking after their own interests and, as usual, our government is more than willing to help them at this even if it costs Canadian jobs. Our government rarely stands up to the states even if they are in the right; remember the softwood lumber dispute(s).

I dont think the issue is whether we can compete with the US, it is with China and other Asian countries. They pay pennies a day to work their asses off to make cheap crap and we buy it. On the other hand, a guy can get a job pulling lumber off the chain with a grade 12 education at $24-26 bucks an hr plus full benefits. Also keep in mind that we have to follow strong labour codes, safety implementations etc and they dont. They work in heavy industry wearing sandals. Tough to compete with that.

 

[grizzlymud]

Also think has lots to do with the work ethic of people now a days, its a joke. Everything is cost plus usually and the workers actually work less as then they stay longer and work more. One job we had was budgeted for $10 mill and cost $300 and everyone thinks thats just the cost of doing business. Till this changes it's going to keep going downhill. IMO

 

[frock]

I dont think the issue is whether we can compete with the US, it is with China and other Asian countries. They pay pennies a day to work their asses off to make cheap crap and we buy it. On the other hand, a guy can get a job pulling lumber off the chain with a grade 12 education at $24-26 bucks an hr plus full benefits. Also keep in mind that we have to follow strong labour codes, safety implementations etc and they dont. They work in heavy industry wearing sandals. Tough to compete with that.

This has nothing to do with any country other than the US. This pipeline will ship Canadian oil into the States where they will refine it and not us.

 

[eclipse1966]

This has nothing to do with any country other than the US. This pipeline will ship Canadian oil into the States where they will refine it and not us.

I realize the pipeline has nothing to do about offshore but previous posts in the thread talk about being competitive with offshore hence my comment about being competitive. Either was I am not disagreeing with you as I too would like us to compete with US or anyone else for the benefit of Canadian's.

 

[Pinner]

This has nothing to do with any country other than the US. This pipeline will ship Canadian oil into the States where they will refine it and not us.

No, the difference is getting our oil to shore, so it can compete against the Brent crude Et al... our oil is landlocked, ever hear of supply vs demand ? We will get more money for the oil if we get it to a port so it can get the best price.

 

[frock]

No, the difference is getting our oil to shore, so it can compete against the Brent crude Et al... our oil is landlocked, ever hear of supply vs demand ? We will get more money for the oil if we get it to a port so it can get the best price.

So why can't this oil be refined in Canada before it goes to port????????????? And yes I am quite familiar with supply versus demand in fact I "hear" about supply and demand everyday when I pay 20 cents a litre more for fuel than some guy in Vancouver and I live where we work our azzes off to get it out of the ground.

 

[ferniesnow]

Why can't we compete?????????????? I don't think it's a case of "can't compete". I think it's a case of us not getting the chance to compete because the States is looking after their own interests and, as usual, our government is more than willing to help them at this even if it costs Canadian jobs. Our government rarely stands up to the states even if they are in the right; remember the softwood lumber dispute(s).

eclipse1966 answered it well. My comment was about the global economy and not just the Keystone pipeline. We can't compete with Mexico and Asia and that is why raw logs go overseas and come back processed. Most things are made in countries with cheaper labour. Maybe we need to start charging higher prices for our natural resources and put away some nest eggs. With regards to refining crude, I wouldn't be surprised that the workers in the States are paid less less than Canadian workers therefore they can refine it cheaper. I'm not in the oil business so I don't know for sure. If the US refineries are not running at full capacity then it makes economic sense to refine it there. I don't agree with it but economically it makes sense to refine it where it can be done cheaper.

 

[Pinner]

So why can't this oil be refined in Canada before it goes to port?????????????

We don't have the refineries, we don't have the manpower to build them, and we don't have the time. There is a ZERO percent chance of refining what the what will be produced, ZERO.

We could put all the production increases on hold for 10-20 years while we build the infrastructure to refine here in Canada... We already have a massive labour shortage.

Major engineering and construction firms have warned that the next few years could bring another labour crunch, and Mr. George acknowledged that "the biggest risk, the biggest challenge, is to get enough manpower on these projects."
Suncor has made changes to lessen that burden. It has structured each project to need no more than 4,000 workers at a time - down from the 7,000 it has used in the past.

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