Snow and Mud BAD reputation

[Sledderglen]

Companies that are not green are often overlooked as well as business practices and the team green pick on our activity because we are easy targets. Like some of our Avitars showing riders in huge mud holes or in creeks and rivers or talking about how stuck we get or how we ripped up some muskeg hole. This as well as this thread is all fuel for the fight against us. So it would be good for us all to clean up our avitars and our stories and pictures and videos.
Time to ride responsibily and maybe we will still be able to enjoy the bush for a while yet. Or keep complaining when areas get shut down and our image remains negative.

"JUST SAYING"

 

[arff]

Education is key.
Do as we say not as we do
Show our kids how to ride not making ruts

 

[smkngstv]

Companies that are not green are often overlooked as well as business practices and the team green pick on our activity because we are easy targets. Like some of our Avitars showing riders in huge mud holes or in creeks and rivers or talking about how stuck we get or how we ripped up some muskeg hole. This as well as this thread is all fuel for the fight against us. So it would be good for us all to clean up our avitars and our stories and pictures and videos.
Time to ride responsibily and maybe we will still be able to enjoy the bush for a while yet. Or keep complaining when areas get shut down and our image remains negative.

"JUST SAYING"

i do understand what you are all saying i donot make it a prsctice of driving in streams this piture was taken in vega buy my son and he was proud of his piture and asked if i can post it on snow and mud so as a good father i did.and now he has to read this chit its just a piture.i have geared all 3 of my kids for quadding and it is a great way to spend family time together.enjoying the camping,riding ect.not walking the streets of edmonton and my wife and i worring if they are safe:d

 

[Garryese]

If education is the key then here is today's education piece:

Sledderglen's comments are correct and the few that have been actively involved in keeping trails open truly understand where he is coming from. For the mass majority of those who only talk the talk, let me take you for a short walk... Typically when we attend meetings or open houses to keep trails open, those who are opposed to our activities show up with a box of pitcures, videos, avitors and stories from forums like this one. They suggest it is an admission of guilt and we use the "it's one bad apple..." excuse, they produce another similar box, we use another excuse, they produce another box, and so on until eventually we are beaten into submission. We have discovered when the boxes come out, there are no safe defenses or excuses.

We are our own worse enemy more times than not. I'm not lecturing Smkngstv but in the sprite of Arff's advise of "education is the key" let me demonstrate the problem with the following statement:

...it is a piture of me in the water,so what.we as a group do obey the rules when quadding ....

Obeying the rules means obeying the law (I assume) and it is against the law to be in navigatable or flowing waters with an ATV, for which the Department of Fisheries and Oceans is responsible for enforcing. DFO has identified much smaller and shallower waters as being navigatable than the avi depics. So when this one is drawing out of the box the "other side" might interpret the above statment as Most ATVers ("we as a group") see themselves as using rules above the law and they don't care ("so what"). It's unbelievable sometimes how simple statments can get so twisted, but it does happen like that.

Hopeful you can see why Sledderglen's post is great advise.

BTW, protection of flowing water was debated a 100 years ago and was a condition of Alberta becoming a province. In the 1940 the fedral government threatened Alberta with taking over protection of the eastern slopes if Alberta didn't provide better protection and thus Alberta developed the concept of FLUZ areas. In the late 1970s the Feds once again returned with similar threats that resulted in SRD actively enforcing FLUZ restrictions. Ever since DFO has taken liberties in definitions and enforcing the Federal laws.

 

[Snowdin]

Those greenie weinies have been very successful in shutting down ATV use in the Kananaskis area. They want to make the entire Rocky Mountain range from Yellowstone park to Alaska a Wildlife Preserve Park and the only way a human would be able to enter would be on foot or on horseback. There are several societies involved like the Sierra Club. They consist of Doctors, Lawyers and Hollywood types. They are well funded and we are arming them to the teeth with ammunition. If we want to continue to have fun with our toys I believe there has to be some respect on our parts.

 

[Puba]

Agree, the area I am referring to is along the highway which is a fish bearing stream..... I don't mind crossing a creek, river etc. but you don't go into one and run up and down and up and down and back and forth over and over and over again.......... Point A to Point B so you have the minimal impact on the river structure.

Not sure but in our group that Darcy and then Lyle led.....the trails that we are all being told in this thread went through the rivers....so kinda tough to not be in the rivers and then in the next breath stick to the trails....hmmmm

Thanks Lyle and Darcy for the great adventures..

 

[arff]

Last year at ram falls.
The trail to onion lake was closed till July 1st
The ranger was parked at start of the trail giving out tickets to quads returning because it was not July 1st.
We road in July 1st talked to the ranger he said trail open go ahead.
If we follow the rules don't rip up areas we can ride for years.
We must lead by example.


Also I have seen horse back riders leave a very large mess at ram falls.
my 2 cents worth

 

[Snowdin]

Last year at ram falls.
The trail to onion lake was closed till July 1st
The ranger was parked at start of the trail giving out tickets to quads returning because it was not July 1st.
We road in July 1st talked to the ranger he said trail open go ahead.
If we follow the rules don't rip up areas we can ride for years.
We must lead by example.


Also I have seen horse back riders leave a very large mess at ram falls.
my 2 cents worth

I know what your saying. It actually burns my butt that a special interest group can dictate who can or can not use our great outdoors.

 

[Iron Horse Racing]

Doesn’t matter whether you ride ATV, Horses, Trucks or just hike....there are responsible people in all of these groups and there are also idiots (to many of them) in all of these groups....

The educated user will know when and where to ride and when not to….and it’s up to us to help police this or it will be gone and it won’t matter what you want to ride ..There won’t be a place to go….

Just look around if everyone is responsible….why is there so much garbage in the bush, trails wrecked beyond repair.

My family and I are not resort campers like many on this site we prefer the bush…..and have been camping on crown land since I was a kid, we hike, climb, canoe, ride ATV, Snowmobiles and horses.

Like many others I have had a chat or two with some idiots that feel there is so much land out there that they can do what they want…what’s the big deal. We have hauled out other people’s garbage from places all over this province, you just wouldn’t think responsible people would be that disrespectful.

We carry shovels and a rake and believe in “no trace camping” “Pack it in you pack it out”

So whats the answer......

 

[Taminator]

Ditto, Iron Horse.

There's fault in every group. There's always someone setting a bad example but there are many who set good examples as well. All we can do is look after ourselves, educate others and do what we can to ensure continued use of areas. Blaming others and having the 'he did it, so can I' mentality doesn't benefit the cause. Check areas before going in for closures, restrictions etc. and make responsible decisions. If others are riding a closed area that's thier choice but we don't have to follow.

We camp in the bush at undeveloped sites, and still have to clean up an area before we use it. We're careful not to attract bears, garbage not left out, cook on fire and remove all traces of food/grease...etc. A necessity in bear country. Last weekend we found garbage bags stashed in the bush right next to the site, hidden well too. Fabulous, at least you hid it well so noone would know they were bear food as they sat around the fire!!! At least put it out where others can see it. Hiding it in the bush to attract wildlife to others isn't a good move. We packed it up, drove it out to the road away from camp and picked it up on the way out. Burn what you can and pack the rest out or leave it where someone more responsible can pack it out!!! We didn't leave our garbage in the bush just cuz someone else did!

 

[glengine]

I grew up in a really small town and spent alot of time in the bush, and loved it.. I still love getting out and enjoying mother nature and all it's beauty. It's been good to see more and more people packing out what they packed in, and not leaving as much garbage behind. But there does still seem to be abit to much garbage being left behind in the bush in my opinion, But in my opinion any garbage left behind is to much.. It's funny to how the fact that the garbage is alot lighter and smaller on the way out than it is on the way in.. There are alot of good people out there, i witnessed quite a few people up the mtn sledding this year that'd see garbage out somewhere and they'd pick it up and take it with them. Thats great to see. And yes everyone is right in the fact that the only one we have control over is ourselves and that the best educating tool can be by example.

 

[Caper11]

I grew up in a really small town and spent alot of time in the bush, and loved it.. I still love getting out and enjoying mother nature and all it's beauty. It's been good to see more and more people packing out what they packed in, and not leaving as much garbage behind. But there does still seem to be abit to much garbage being left behind in the bush in my opinion, But in my opinion any garbage left behind is to much.. It's funny to how the fact that the garbage is alot lighter and smaller on the way out than it is on the way in.. There are alot of good people out there, i witnessed quite a few people up the mtn sledding this year that'd see garbage out somewhere and they'd pick it up and take it with them. Thats great to see. And yes everyone is right in the fact that the only one we have control over is ourselves and that the best educating tool can be by example.

I agree, there are some out there that are going to ruin it for all of us, the the "random camping" is being looked at very closely, due to noise, garbage, and property damage ETC a toy hauler sitting in a field attracts attention.
this summer was very busy down the robb highway for random camping, my favorite spot was busy all summer, which I didn't mind I went somewhere else. BUT what I did mind was the garbage left behind! and one time I was driving home from work I seen a my favorite campsite empty but with a fire still going!! Turned around to put it out!!
I know common sence is not to common but this is getting out of hand.