Remington 700

[the_real_wild1]

Every remington I have owned was a piece of crap. I will never buy another. Everyone needed work to shoot properly. My last one was a 338 lapua and had the trigger issue. About 70% of the time when the safety was dropped the fireing pin would fire. Luckily I knew what was happening and the it would usually happen when a fired round was in the chamber. Kinda hard to explain. I finally rebuilt the trigger and never had the issue again. Sold the rifle shortly after. Had a R25 that needed alot of massaging to eliminate all the ftf and fte issues. Had a xr-100 that you couldnt close the bolt properly. The headspace was out bigtime. It would always scrape a small chunk off the brass.

To top it all off they all shot poorly. The r25 wasnt too bad considering it was an AR. To anyone that things the remingtons now are still the best, well maybe you just dont know any better. My last build was a tikka tactical that I had about $5500 into that did well. Parted it out and planning the next build now.

 

[underdog]

Every remington I have owned was a piece of crap. I will never buy another. Everyone needed work to shoot properly. My last one was a 338 lapua and had the trigger issue. About 70% of the time when the safety was dropped the fireing pin would fire. Luckily I knew what was happening and the it would usually happen when a fired round was in the chamber. Kinda hard to explain. I finally rebuilt the trigger and never had the issue again. Sold the rifle shortly after. Had a R25 that needed alot of massaging to eliminate all the ftf and fte issues. Had a xr-100 that you couldnt close the bolt properly. The headspace was out bigtime. It would always scrape a small chunk off the brass.

To top it all off they all shot poorly. The r25 wasnt too bad considering it was an AR. To anyone that things the remingtons now are still the best, well maybe you just dont know any better. My last build was a tikka tactical that I had about $5500 into that did well. Parted it out and planning the next build now.

To each their own.

Sent from my kickass HTC Desire because Apple sucks!

 

[byronkentgraham]

Every remington I have owned was a piece of crap. I will never buy another. Everyone needed work to shoot properly. My last one was a 338 lapua and had the trigger issue. About 70% of the time when the safety was dropped the fireing pin would fire. Luckily I knew what was happening and the it would usually happen when a fired round was in the chamber. Kinda hard to explain. I finally rebuilt the trigger and never had the issue again. Sold the rifle shortly after. Had a R25 that needed alot of massaging to eliminate all the ftf and fte issues. Had a xr-100 that you couldnt close the bolt properly. The headspace was out bigtime. It would always scrape a small chunk off the brass.

To top it all off they all shot poorly. The r25 wasnt too bad considering it was an AR. To anyone that things the remingtons now are still the best, well maybe you just dont know any better. My last build was a tikka tactical that I had about $5500 into that did well. Parted it out and planning the next build now.

How does a gun fire with a spent round in the chamber? Was the gun new? Was it maintained properly? Had you been in the trigger assembly before?

 

[scotts]

It's a very old issue, started day one with the walker trigger.just thought I would bring it up after listening to the show,
have two remington's myself, they are a middle of the road piece at best in my opinion.

 

[byronkentgraham]

It's a very old issue, started day one with the walker trigger.just thought I would bring it up after listening to the show,
have two remington's myself, they are a middle of the road piece at best in my opinion.

I'm not saying remington is a great gun. Just that people who are saying these guns fire by themselves have not maintained them or have done something to the gun. The people who have killed their family members because the gun "fired on it's own" need to use their head. Who points a loaded firearm at another person

 

[JaySimon]

Who points a loaded firearm at another person

Heck, who points ANY firearm at something they would not be comfortable destroying?

That's frickin gun safety 101.

 

[byronkentgraham]

Heck, who points ANY firearm at something they would not be comfortable destroying?

That's frickin gun safety 101.

I know what you mean.

 

[sirkdev]

Before you rush to judgement about gun safety do some research this is a common problem with the model 700, the US military actually has a term cannot remember it now but anyways for their accidental discharges. They expect the 700's to accidentally fire anytime. and they do.

Agreed whole heartedly about the quality issue, shoot a 700 vs a cz or tikka and you quickly realize what a pile of turd the remingtons are. Of course you can make them shoot, but that will cost you.

I sold my 597 after I tried every kind of ammo under the sun and looked like a guy with parkinsons was shooting. CZ 452 baby, beautiful 22LR 100 yds 1.5" groups.

 

[JaySimon]

Before you rush to judgement about gun safety do some research this is a common problem with the model 700, the US military actually has a term cannot remember it now but anyways for their accidental discharges. They expect the 700's to accidentally fire anytime. and they do.

Maybe so, but safe operation would dictate that nobody gets hit by a round that fires, as you have the barrel pointed at something that doesn't breathe (or is really tasty)

 

[byronkentgraham]

Before you rush to judgement about gun safety do some research this is a common problem with the model 700, the US military actually has a term cannot remember it now but anyways for their accidental discharges. They expect the 700's to accidentally fire anytime. and they do.

Agreed whole heartedly about the quality issue, shoot a 700 vs a cz or tikka and you quickly realize what a pile of turd the remingtons are. Of course you can make them shoot, but that will cost you.

I sold my 597 after I tried every kind of ammo under the sun and looked like a guy with parkinsons was shooting. CZ 452 baby, beautiful 22LR 100 yds 1.5" groups.

Why would the US army use a weapon the may fire at any given time? Why would they use a gun of poor quality? Doesn't make sense when they could be using a .50 Cal. If the guns had that many problems remington would have stopped producing them long ago rather than deal with the lawsuits and chitty reputation.

 

[the_real_wild1]

How does a gun fire with a spent round in the chamber? Was the gun new? Was it maintained properly? Had you been in the trigger assembly before?

Because I am smart enough to know when the rifle was acting up and to NOT have a live round in there. I would have the 5 round mag full. Cycle the bolt to chamber a round and shoot. I would cycle the bolt, eject the spent round and load up the next. The trigger would not pull. Check the bolt and the firing pin would be in the foward position. I would release the mag pull the bolt back and eject the round. Put the bolt foward, put the safety on. Now if the safety was put to the fire position the rifle would fire. Now if a live round was in at the time the rifle would have fired. Make sense? No this did that from day one. Rifle in stock form untouched. Pretty plucking scary considering it was a 338 lapua that put big plucking holes in things.

 

[the_real_wild1]

Oh and the us military doesnt get just any 700 off the shelf.

 

[Summiteer]

The manufacturer of the world's most popular hunting rifle has been wrestling for decades with a critical safety issue, and at least twice considered a nationwide recall of the gun, according to corporate insiders and internal documents revealed in a ten-month CNBC investigation.
But the Remington Arms Company has never alerted the public to the internal concerns, and insists the gun is free of defects, despite thousands of customer complaints.

The controversy over the 700 is explored in a CNBC Original documentary, "Remington Under Fire: A CNBC Investigation," which aired Oct. 20.

The Remington Model 700-series rifle—with more than five million sold—is famous for its accuracy and smooth trigger. In addition to being popular with hunters and target shooters, a version of the 700 is also widely used by law enforcement and military snipers.

"The Model 700 is the most popular, reliable, accurate and trusted bolt-action rifle in the world, with over five million rifles produced and billions of rounds fired over nearly five decades," Remington says in a statement to CNBC.

But the customer complaints, and more than 75 lawsuits, have alleged the 700 is susceptible to firing without the trigger being pulled. At least two dozen deaths and more than 100 injuries have been linked to accidental discharges involving the 700's trigger mechanism.

They include the death in 2000 of nine-year-old Gus Barber of Manhattan, Montana, who was killed on a family hunting trip when his mother's Remington 700 went off as she was unloading it. Barbara Barber has said she is certain her hand was nowhere near the trigger. Her husband Rich Barber, who witnessed the accident, learned within days about similar reported incidents involving the 700.

"I went to the funeral home and looked Gus right square in the eye and I said, 'Son, it ends here and now'," Barber said. He would devote the next ten years to finding answers about what caused his son's death, and is sharing much of his findings for the first time.

Trigger Trouble

The 700 series of rifles dates back to the 1940s, when Remington—which had been purchased a decade earlier by the giant chemical company DuPont—was transitioning from a major supplier of the war effort to a more consumer-oriented company. DuPont, which sold Remington in 1993, declined to be interviewed, referring inquiries to Remington.

The rifle series—which debuted with the Remington 721—featured a unique trigger system patented by a young Remington engineer named Merle "Mike" Walker. Walker has called his design "a perfect trigger," with a smooth pull favored by expert shooters.

According to Walker's patent, the secret was a tiny piece of metal called a "trigger connector," which is mounted loosely inside the firing mechanism. But critics, including ballistics experts who have been hired to testify against the company, say small amounts of rust, debris, or even a small jolt can cause the trigger connector to become misaligned, forcing the trigger itself to lose contact with the rest of the firing mechanism.

Then, the gun can be fired when other parts are operated, such as the safety or the bolt. Barbara Barber says her Remington 700 discharged as she moved the safety to the off position to unload the gun. Others have reported their rifles discharging when they opened, closed or even touched the bolt.

Remington attributes all the incidents to improper maintenance, unsafe gun handling or other actions by the user such as unauthorized adjustments of the trigger.

"Both Remington and experts hired by plaintiff attorneys have conducted testing on guns returned from the field which were alleged to have fired without a trigger pull," Remington's statement says, "and neither has ever been able to duplicate such an event on guns which had been properly maintained and which had not been altered after sale."

"The Model 700, including its trigger mechanism, has been free of any defect since it was first produced," the company adds.

But internal documents obtained by CNBC show that in 1948—before the gun went on the market—Mike Walker himself proposed a design change to prevent the trigger's internal parts from falling out of alignment.

Other documents show the added cost for Walker's "trigger block" came to pennies per gun, but with the rifle already over budget, officials decided against making a change.

 

[scrfce]

I'm not saying remington is a great gun. Just that people who are saying these guns fire by themselves have not maintained them or have done something to the gun. The people who have killed their family members because the gun "fired on it's own" need to use their head. Who points a loaded firearm at another person

Maybe some were riccocheted ( fawked if i know how to spell that ) into people??? Oh ya remington = pos

 

[byronkentgraham]

If the guns were unsafe the government would have forced Remington to either recall the product or issue a warning

 

[JaySimon]

Other documents show the added cost for Walker's "trigger block" came to pennies per gun, but with the rifle already over budget, officials decided against making a change.

Oh corporate responsibility, how I love you.

 

[Summiteer]

If the guns were unsafe the government would have forced Remington to either recall the product or issue a warning

Curious what the "accidental discharge" numbers are for similar rifles. Seems strange if only remington 700 owners are so stupid that they shoot their friends and family in those numbers.....(which is what's happening if there is nothing wrong with the weapon)

 

[AkNomad]

I borrowed a Remington 700 in 243 from a friend of mine for my wife a few years ago that she used on a sheep hunt. We had issues with the bolt opening while it was in the safe position and she actually lost a few rounds of ammo. I got tired of having to check that rifle every 10 minutes so we emptied the magazine and she carried like that for the rest of the hunt. She now owns a Kimber and no more issues with the bolt.

I saw this documentary and it just gave me another reason to not own a Remington. Kimbers and Winchesters are all we own in bolt guns now.

 

[the_real_wild1]

If the guns were unsafe the government would have forced Remington to either recall the product or issue a warning

Are you just trying to stir the pot or just a dumbass?

 

[scotts]

If the guns were unsafe the government would have forced Remington to either recall the product or issue a warning

You would think!! But under laws of the 5th admendment the American government cannot force a recall on the gun manufactures.