Let’s talk skid steers with tracks?

[pfi572]

Looking at purchasing used with around the 1000 hrs.
Was leaning towards the ASV ,Terex but have moved away from them and looking at Cat with same under-carriage.
- Wondering about serviceably on different makes .
- 70 to 100 hp ish machines
- suspension under carriage. ( costly to repair and not recommended for gravel)
- solid track frame doesn’t make sense to me other then cheap.
I have been around equipment all my life but always bigger machines and never paid any attention to these until lately.

 

[skegpro]

Can't speak for cat but I have had Kubota svl-75 for a few years and it has been good.

 

[Flyer]

They do amazing things, if you need that capability. They've always looked unnecessary and awkward for snow removal. On frozen ground, I think I'd prefer tires, with chains if needed.

Very expensive cost cost per hour to operate when undercarriage replacement is compared to tire replacement.

Whats your application? For soft ground, or limiting compaction for final finish of landscaping, they make sense. They'll also lift a lot more before tipping because the small front idler is so much closer to the bucket.

 

[kanedog]

I could not live without my tracked skid steer. Compact track loader to be pc.
Damn thing is like my right hand.
If money permits, get a full load with cab. Just go for it! Itll be the best purchase of your life. Attachments are like heroin tho. I must warn you.

 

[neilsleder]

Not very much time in either. But from what I seen the tracked is not near as twitchy as a tire one, digs in less when turning, and rides smoother. The tires seem to grip better for snow but I here you can stud the tracks, not sure if that’s true. And like said the tracks seem to lift more. But I only push a bit of snow in the yard and lift the odd pallet here and there. Guys that work with them day in and day out might have different views

 

[kakwa climber]

We have both. I can tell you we have bought the biggest available each time. We use them everyday. I have a wheeled cat and my brothers both have tracked machines. My next will be tracked.

 

[Popsiclestand]

Looking at purchasing used with around the 1000 hrs.
Was leaning towards the ASV ,Terex but have moved away from them and looking at Cat with same under-carriage.
- Wondering about serviceably on different makes .
- 70 to 100 hp ish machines
- suspension under carriage. ( costly to repair and not recommended for gravel)
- solid track frame doesn’t make sense to me other then cheap.
I have been around equipment all my life but always bigger machines and never paid any attention to these until lately.
//uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180330/ff13785f302d945cf759494d5b015f72.jpg

-The Cat solid track frames have issues in the 259D series, due to only being a half stub shaft causing premature wear on the bushing. You'll notice the track frames lean inwards towards the cab if it has the issue. It's an expensive repair paying Finning rates. For the reason I'd recommend 279 and up, we havent seen that failure on anything other than the 259D's.
-It's also imperative on the cat solid track frames to ensure they keep taking grease on the stub shafts. If it's not kept up with they'll stop taking grease and you have to pull the track frame off and clean the grease passage.


That being said the solid track frame is a tried and true design and what I would look towards before an ASV system. The Cat Rental Store/Finning has lots of used skidsteers in the "dirt tested" range which is 500 hours or less for great savings compared to a new unit.

 

[Merc63]

Cat has two different under carriages. Steel and multi terrain I'd guess you'd call it? I have the multi terrain, like the pic you posted in a 247b3. New since 2011, we've replaced a drive hose on either side and that's it. 2600hrs, works perfectly.

Tracks lasted around 1800hrs. You can't run them like a wheel machine on pavement, need to do several point turns or you'll destroy the tracks quick. The ride, traction and floatation are all terrific.

The 257 is a nice machine, 2spd with vertical lift. But it depends on what you're using it for... radial lift is better for grading, but sucks to load a tall tandem with. The new 239 is a nice little machine as well. IMO Cat makes the best skid steers, the Kubota is nice, cheaper too, but I don't like the under carriage design if you're in mud, they get gummed up and hard to clean.

Stay away from Terex, lots have drive motor issues.

 

[gibsons]

The track system you are looking at there are crap. What are your main uses for this unit, is what would determine between track and rubber tire.
The newer under carriages from cat are tough, as well as the over all reliability of them, how ever you tend to pay a bit more for the usually.
Currently I'm running a 272r/t, 279D, a 299D,a 299D XHP, an older komatsu 35 on track, and last year bought a bobcat 650 r/t.
Wanted to give bobcat another shot since the past models left a sour taste in our mouth.( had t250's. T300's that were money pits). The new 650 has been in for warranty work a couple times already, and there is a noticeable difference in speed of the hydraulics and over all power. Older bobcats we had to get rid of at 1400 hours due to what they were costing. All our cats are sitting between 3-4500 hours and minimal costs of normal wear and tear( tracks, tires, filters, and batteries). The komatsu is a tank and I would put that up against my 299D XHP for pushing power however the lifting power of the hydraulics suck, but this unit hasn't cost us anything except your typical maintenance. However the biggest downfall to that unit is the cab sucks big time. Wanted to try case last year but everytime I jumped in one I hated it. I will be going back to cats in the future.

 

[Mach1]

Cat hmmmmm
ive had both and never problem in snow or ice if you use the machine correctly, had contract with city St. Albert and can always out push and break up ice faster and better then a wheel machine. But didn't like the speed going long distance so if had two speed now, that's what I would buy.

 

[gibsons]

2 speed is a must
Track machines are slower but have better floatation and much better in gravel and dirt.
R/T are quicker, better on asphalt and better for snow removal.

 

[PS94]

I have both machines, both Cat, both vertical lift. The 287 track unit DOES NOT enjoy gravel. they mean it. Ive ruined hoses on it with gravel getting jammed in spots it shouldn't. The tracks are amazing for doing most anything, and it stays more level and is amazing for dirt work. When the tracks get worn they will begin to ratchet pushing heavy loads, and the roller drives wear quick if not maintained.
The 252 is a wheeled two speed machine, and you can't neglect the chains and boxes. Two speed on this unit was disabled during the PDI but I'm going to re-enable it soon as it is nice. The wheeled unit gets stuck anywhere there is snow or ice as it is not chained. It is faster, turns better and does the same stuff as the track, but is rough and I'm not as confident lifting as much with the wheeled unit, but both can lift a small truck or SUV.
I 'll have them both at my place by sexsmith in spring if you'd like to play in them side by side, and one will be getting sold.

 

[skegpro]

Not very much time in either. But from what I seen the tracked is not near as twitchy as a tire one, digs in less when turning, and rides smoother. The tires seem to grip better for snow but I here you can stud the tracks, not sure if that’s true. And like said the tracks seem to lift more. But I only push a bit of snow in the yard and lift the odd pallet here and there. Guys that work with them day in and day out might have different views

https://www.clawm.com/clawm-endless-track-vehicle-traction-products

 

[Zrock]

We just recently got rid of our tracked machine as we are going to get a small loader. I would take a tracked machine over tires any day. They work great every ware but its hard on tracks on hardpack. We used on gravel consistently with no issues at all and plowed snow with it for years and it would push more snow than any tired machine, as well you can drive over the snow and keep your piles high and pushed back. We would go through idlers every few years due to our own fault of carrying heavy loads a distance. Best thing we did when we put new tracks on it was put a camoplast winter/summer track on it. excellent grip and you could push and actually stall the machine at full throttle they gripped to well.

 

[pfi572]

https://youtu.be/RzmwepHQUKM

Good video showing the difference ?

https://youtu.be/pIoPFVNi_pI

Thanks folks the info as very helpful.
I understand the pros and cons between wheels and tires and tires aren’t for me.

 

[go big]

after running track on last two machines, i'd never buy a tire machine. but mostly soft ground work. for winter finning was telling me guys are throwing the camoplast tracks on and work well.

 

[Cyle]

You absolutely want to stay away from the mtl type undercarriage with plastic rollers, the maintenance will break you. If you absolutely do not need a track machine, you are much better off with a wheeled. Any time you're doing anything a wheeled machine can do as well, or better, you're throwing a lot of money out the window. Maintenance on a track machine is very very expensive, you need to factor $10-$15/hr on top of a wheeled machine. Most still use the same drive motors, and it's not uncommon to be replacing them every few thousand hours, and it's not a cheap repair. Cat machines seem to stand up well, but the price tag makes it tough to justify, but personally not a fan of the motors. But a big factor is how well they are looked after, they will eat you alive with a crappy operator who doesn't look after it.

A lot of people who only run tracks have no idea what a wheeled machine is capable of with the right operator. Track machines are awful on asphalt/concrete and will cost you a fortune in tracks, not to mention being much slower then wheels. It does depend on what you're using it for.

They have their place though. I rent PT30's somewhat regularly as they are super useful in tight areas, but would never dream of buying one. Everyone I talk to who owns one would buy something else if there was an option, very expensive to maintain and a lot of problems.

 

[Merc63]

Pt30 is a piece of trash compared to a cat track machine. Cat doesn't have drive motor issues like they do.

I have 2600hrs on my 247b3, I replaced the tracks once, the boggie wheels and everything else on the under carriage is original.

MTL is for soil and clay work, don't buy one if you're running in gravel or road crush. The key to a low maintenance Cat track machine is operator training. No spinning on gravel or pavement, easy over curbs etc. Keep the under carriage clean.

The new ASV rc30 seems to be much better than the Terex pt30s so far.

 

[pfi572]

Agree about Operator . Some people are drivers and poor at that. Lol
Drives me crazy having to watch .

 

[Cyle]

Pt30 is a piece of trash compared to a cat track machine. Cat doesn't have drive motor issues like they do.

I have 2600hrs on my 247b3, I replaced the tracks once, the boggie wheels and everything else on the under carriage is original.

MTL is for soil and clay work, don't buy one if you're running in gravel or road crush. The key to a low maintenance Cat track machine is operator training. No spinning on gravel or pavement, easy over curbs etc. Keep the under carriage clean.

The new ASV rc30 seems to be much better than the Terex pt30s so far.

Do you know who makes the drive motors for the cats? Many all of them are the same whether it's a case, bobcat, takeuchi, john deere, etc etc Cat does not make their own, they use the same ones I believe case and JD use. And virtually all of them have some issues with them. The pt30 is in a class of it's own because no one else makes a 4' wide track machine with a cab. Bobcat stopped making the t110. At 2600 hours you're likely on the cusp of a massive $10-15k undercarriage repairs.