Interesting article on Supertrax recently......

[climbmax]

SUPERTRAXMAG.COM - Home of Supertrax International - Snowmobiling's Most Read, Most Opinionated and Highest Circulation Magazine

This should get you all going for a while

 

[tex78]

Ya but that's flat land, lake to trail riding.... They can have there 130, heavy 4 smoke

At altitude we need the extra 30 plus horse and lighter weight

Unless u have a big pocket book and light weight and boost a 4 smoke

 

[Anvil1010]

I can't put into words how much I detest Supertrax et al and the Lesters.

 

[Clode]

the four stroke motocross bike has done it, I remember when the YZ400f came out and people said it's "to heavy" and "they will never dominate".....look where we are today...I don't think you will ever see 2-strokes gone but out east I can see the 4-stroke sled becoming the choice.....polaris better be developing one or they will fall behind

 

[blubbles]

Eventually I think they will outsell the two stroke... Hard to compete with the amount of torque and longevity that you can get out of the four stroke. For many of the flatland trail riders, being able to go thousands and thousands of kms without rebuilding would be pretty hard to beat. And just as it has been said, reliable turbos would change the game big time for power at altitude.

In the mountain segment right now I don't think its the case though. Weight difference is just too much, and can't justify spending 30k on a sled to get it to where they need to be.

 

[Bnorth]

the four stroke motocross bike has done it, I remember when the YZ400f came out and people said it's "to heavy" and "they will never dominate".....look where we are today...I don't think you will ever see 2-strokes gone but out east I can see the 4-stroke sled becoming the choice.....polaris better be developing one or they will fall behind

The 4 stroke moto bikes only took over because the AMA created rules holding the smokers to 125 and 250cc in the 250 and 450 classes respectively. The majority of offroad (ie hare scramble, rocks & logs etc) racers are still on smokers because the 300's are allowed. The freestyle guys are basically all still on smokers as well.

 

[Old-Soul]

They'll never replace the smell.

 

[tex78]

They'll never replace the smell.

Mmmmmmmmm 2 smoke

 

[SLEDBUNNYRACING]

I could see myself on a fourstroke as a trail rider but at this time I'm in the mountains and could see myself on one. I do believe that will change in the future with power to weight ratios getting closer and closer.


Tapatalk....well I'm happy with you now....thanks for the fix.

 

[Joholio]

I heard Climbmax rides a heavy four stroke boat anchor. :stir: jk lol

Question for you Randy... What in your opinion is the best two stroke 800?

Doo, Poo or Cat? Lol

 

[MtnMaster]

if they can make it weigh the same, and have the same HP as a 2 stroke, then its a no brainer.... Until then, not a chance.
Maintenance and reliability of a 4st is very tempting, until they do go boom. Then your wallet is in for a world of hurtin'

I liked the light weight of a 2st dirtbike, so I bought a yz250 and poured a ton of money into it. It still wouldn't come close to touching my yz450, so I sold it and am back on a '15 yz450 again. But, the dirtbike game is a whole lot different than mtn sledding.

 

[LBZ]

For those on FB, I'd like to find out more about this. Gets it a little closer to the power of the 2S without the weight of a turbo. Might be able to get the weights alot closer. https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1249191275107184&id=208691449157177

Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk

 

[mur190]

Randy if Yamaha put a decent two stroke in the new cat/yammy chassis and you could lay some reliable 220+hp boost to it would you ride that or the viper?

 

[SLEDBUNNYRACING]

For those on FB, I'd like to find out more about this. Gets it a little closer to the power of the 2S without the weight of a turbo. Might be able to get the weights alot closer. https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1249191275107184&id=208691449157177

Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk

For me it's about weight, power and cost.
If it costs me 5k more to get the power/weight to match two stroke then I remain at two stroke (the Doo's XM has been very reliable and getting tons of miles before rebuilds).
That being said, I've always liked the idea of a four stroke.



Tapatalk....well I'm happy with you now....thanks for the fix.

 

[Rotax_Kid]

After owning both modded 2 strokes and 4 strokes currently and in the past, I wish there was a happy medium.

I like how the Etec runs, but after owning a few 4 strokes the Etec's powerband feels like a on/off switch and I know it's as refined and smooth as it comes with a 2 stroke. I miss the midrange and bottom end torque the 4 stroke has.

On the opposite side it handles better, runs really consistent for a 2 stroke, and is really east to correct mid air.

Part of me wants to build another 4 stroke with boost, part of me says stick with the 2 stroke. With more and more riding occurring here in Sask, where we can do 200 mile days if we want to, the 4 stroke has the edge. Go west and I could ride either. Both have more capability than I do at the end of the day, but I do feel less tired riding the 2 stroke after 3-4 days in a row.

I do know we have a 1200 that has close t 8500 miles under low boost. I could never dream of that on a stock 2 stroke never mind one with 220hp.

Maybe I keep both...

 

[Joholio]

SUPERTRAXMAG.COM - Home of Supertrax International - Snowmobiling's Most Read, Most Opinionated and Highest Circulation Magazine

This should get you all going for a while

We were all revved up and now we're bored again. Stir it up for us! Lol

 

[summit889]

Randy if Yamaha put a decent two stroke in the new cat/yammy chassis and you could lay some reliable 220+hp boost to it would you ride that or the viper?

I'm not going to speak for Randy, but I own an MCX nytro, Boost it Viper, and a TSS Etec. I just sold the TSS kit because the sled only ever gets ridden by my 12 yr old. I much prefer boosted 4 stroke no matter how tight the riding gets. Low end is so much better, and sled just keeps pulling.

 

[Clode]

2-stroke HP has pretty much hit a wall at this displacement, and still make emissions....a 2-stroke turbo will never make emission standards due to all the un-burnt hydrocarbons so I doubt you will ever see a factory 2-stroke turbo....so to make emissions friendly HP more displacement is needed and engine weight will increase...on the other hand turbo 4-strokes will make emissions(auto industry), and they are getting lighter, and are making big power very reliably...we should see same very powerful factory 4-strokes in the future

 

[174mcx]

I usually don't get involved in any of these kinds of threads but im really anxious for snow so here it goes.

I agree with the weight / hp / cost statements.

I dont agree with the 30g cost for a decent four stroke. To make a decent four stroke, say something with the same hp/lb ratio as a new skidoo, keeping in mind what elevation you ride at, it really doesn't cost any different. If you don't want to "make" a 4 stroke and are limited to the stock orientations of all sled manufactures then thats it, your limited.

Stock 4stroke to stock 2stroke theres no comparison, no one will argue that in a mountain riding senario. When the rx1 came out it was sad, but they have come along way since then. If you want to talk about being more tired at the end of the day because the sled is to heavy, get to the gym your health depends on it. One could argue that my shoulders get tired from pouring 2stroke oil, changing belts, rebuilding motors and pulling on a starting rope all day. If you want to compare sleds, compare sleds if you want to compare your pysical condition do that, don't combine the two. Good riders can ride any sled well, within minutes most times. They might feel "funny" or "different" but the ideas are all the same.

I hope any manufacturer in the next few years makes a big change in the industry. In the mid to late 90's the hp/lb ratio changed significantly and since then it hasn't changed that much. Sleds are already very light all they need are more power.

 

[tex78]

I usually don't get involved in any of these kinds of threads but im really anxious for snow so here it goes.

I agree with the weight / hp / cost statements.

I dont agree with the 30g cost for a decent four stroke. To make a decent four stroke, say something with the same hp/lb ratio as a new skidoo, keeping in mind what elevation you ride at, it really doesn't cost any different. If you don't want to "make" a 4 stroke and are limited to the stock orientations of all sled manufactures then thats it, your limited.

Stock 4stroke to stock 2stroke theres no comparison, no one will argue that in a mountain riding senario. When the rx1 came out it was sad, but they have come along way since then. If you want to talk about being more tired at the end of the day because the sled is to heavy, get to the gym your health depends on it. One could argue that my shoulders get tired from pouring 2stroke oil, changing belts, rebuilding motors and pulling on a starting rope all day. If you want to compare sleds, compare sleds if you want to compare your pysical condition do that, don't combine the two. Good riders can ride any sled well, within minutes most times. They might feel "funny" or "different" but the ideas are all the same.

I hope any manufacturer in the next few years makes a big change in the industry. In the mid to late 90's the hp/lb ratio changed significantly and since then it hasn't changed that much. Sleds are already very light all they need are more power.

Pouring 2 smoke oil in???

I don't touch my oil for 3 tanks of fuel lol, and I have seen nitros with oil topped up every ride so that is nill and void

Belts is also a non issue ( at least for doo)

Engines, also a non issue for doo now as lots of etech with 10000 plus km on them


I still think for anything other than straight chute machine, a boosted 2 smoke is the best all around machine