Government to cash in on Revy tragedy.

[harpold700 3]

I really like your petition idea, we must not let the gov't get any farther into our pockets. Civil disobediance by all should be the result if gov't "ramrods" this crap down our collective throats.

 

[kbxsrx]

Just a minute here. This was one incident. Hikers, Mountain Climbers, Skiers, River Rafters, Sailboat operators, have probably used SAR one heck of a lot more
than sledders have over the years.

BUT, again, 1,2, or 17 isolated incidents over a 12 month period of time will NEVER get the same media response as un unsanctioned event in which according again to the media, where HUNDREDS of people are involved.

Not hard to figure out.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy BIS, even competed in 05 and 06. But when I heard about the conditions this year, I stayed home.

 

[Polarblu]

Allot of these post sound pretty juvenile. Sledders are better that that!! Who cares what river rafters do? leave the furry hippies to do what they do.

I dont point fingers at other sports in order to take blame from myself.
I believe if all us sledders actually discussed a way that our rescues wouldnt put a burden on others we could do it in a very inexpensive and efficient manner.

One idea is that SPOT thing that uses an insurance company to pay SAR. one of those per group as a required, and sledder enforced, practice would be a start.
Refuse to ride with people who dont have the proper gear. A bunch of granola crunchers couldnt have saved that many people, those were sledders!!

 

[kbxsrx]

But, a lot of it boils down to comon sense too. We all have had a false feeling of security in the hills, and a lot of us have taken unnecessary risks. I remember going underneath a HUGE cornice at Pemberton, to get to another area. We all knew we would be instantly dead if it let loose, yet pinned it through and started breating again once clear.

I try to take a slightly different approach now.

If it is a thunderstorm I dont go golfing. If the roads are glare ice I dont drive the corvette. If there are gale force winds and 10' waves I dont take the kids kneeboarding.

And, if there are EXTREME avalanche conditions and warnings listed for a particular weekend, you won't catch me on top of a mountain.

 

[m8cat]

But, a lot of it boils down to comon sense too. We all have had a false feeling of security in the hills, and a lot of us have taken unnecessary risks. I remember going underneath a HUGE cornice at Pemberton, to get to another area. We all knew we would be instantly dead if it let loose, yet pinned it through and started breating again once clear.

I try to take a slightly different approach now.

If it is a thunderstorm I dont go golfing. If the roads are glare ice I dont drive the corvette. If there are gale force winds and 10' waves I dont take the kids kneeboarding.

And, if there are EXTREME avalanche conditions and warnings listed for a particular weekend, you won't catch me on top of a mountain.

Common sense in really not that common anymore.....?

 

[fargineyesore]

BUT, again, 1,2, or 17 isolated incidents over a 12 month period of time will NEVER get the same media response as un unsanctioned event in which according again to the media, where HUNDREDS of people are involved.

Not hard to figure out.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy BIS, even competed in 05 and 06. But when I heard about the conditions this year, I stayed home.

I agree with you. I also canceled a trip earlier this year because I didn't like the conditions. And I agree that what happened at Boulder is what the media feeds on. I think that sledders need to do two things, speak up to the media and the politicians, and make better decisions. I'm still trying to understand how someone didn't think that it was a bad idea to be sitting under that mountain when people were running the hill. Maybe someone did say something, but nobody listened? I wasn't there, so I won't point fingers or criticize, but with what happened in last year's season, didn't anyone think of that?

 

[ZRrrr]

I could only find SAR data from 2005, but maritime (Oceanic based) SAR activity FAR, FAR exceeds all others.

Humanitarian includes ground and inland water.

If anyone wants to complain about SAR costs, snowmobiler related costs are WAAAAY DOWN on the list.

Also included a link to the full report.



Someone send that to the media asking about costs!!!!!

 

[ZRrrr]

I checked in with the BC SAR website and all the stats sectino states is that it's "coming soon". Wonder how long it has stated that?

BCSARA - British Columbia Search And Rescue Association

 

[Polarblu]

I could only find SAR data from 2005, but maritime (Oceanic based) SAR activity FAR, FAR exceeds all others.

Humanitarian includes ground and inland water.

If anyone wants to complain about SAR costs, snowmobiler related costs are WAAAAY DOWN on the list.

Also included a link to the full report.



Someone send that to the media asking about costs!!!!!

Back to juvenile pointing fingers crap!!! Grow up!!

And for love of Pete understand what you are posting. Those are fisheries rescues for some of the most dangerous jobs on the planet.
I dont have actual facts on this but im sure that the fisheries unions pay extra to help fund SAR.
Any fishermen can chime in on this.

 

[Steve D]

You know, someone up above pointed out checking out avy conditions. I'm not going to lie, I don't know where to look for that info. While it's nothing for me to google it, it's definitely not in the forefront of my mind.

I wonder how hard it would be to make a little weather/avy widget for people to put on websites or homepages? Would snow and mud be interested in little box/banner that has conditions that each user would set locally? Click a link and you can go to a map of the province to plan a trip? Might help with awareness if nothing else. I might look into this later.

 

[ZRrrr]

Back to juvenile pointing fingers crap!!! Grow up!!

And for love of Pete understand what you are posting. Those are fisheries rescues for some of the most dangerous jobs on the planet.
I dont have actual facts on this but im sure that the fisheries unions pay extra to help fund SAR.
Any fishermen can chime in on this.

Excuse me!!?? At whom did I point fingers? What's juvenile about posting government issued, publicly accessible information.

If for a moment you thought less of yourself and looked at the topic of discussion you would relaize that the media is playing up the costs for this S&R of recent. My intent was only to show that the costs for this and all other snowmobile related S&R is relatively small in comparison to others, especially considering that snowmobile S&R is included in all other ground and inland water S&R.

Having a bad day..........

 

[fargineyesore]

Back to juvenile pointing fingers crap!!! Grow up!!

And for love of Pete understand what you are posting. Those are fisheries rescues for some of the most dangerous jobs on the planet.
I dont have actual facts on this but im sure that the fisheries unions pay extra to help fund SAR.
Any fishermen can chime in on this.

I doubt if all the maritime rescues are for fisheries. I'm sure some are for pleasure craft as well. I think the point is to refute the argument that sledders shouldn't be in the back country because it costs money to rescue them if they have problems. Sure, some sledders need to make better decisions, but if all that use SAR are charged with the costs of the rescue if it can be determined that their predicament could have been avoided with better decisions, most would be charged with the rescue.

 

[CR500R]

I feel us snowmobilers have to band together and let our government know that these licensing and insurance regulations are not going to help but hinder snowmobiler safety. These regulations are not for snowmobiler safety, they are just another "tax". I feel disgusted that the goverment used the Revelstoke tragedy to justify there new "tax". I hope Kevin Krueger can sleep well tonight.

I don't understand this thinking, how can you say it doesn't do anything for safety but hinders it instead....

I'm all for licensing and insurance. It shouldn't be any different than having auto insurance and registration. What cracks me up is the whiners that can run out and buy a new sled worth $10,000 + or the more money than brains fool that spends 20 - 40,000 grand on a sled that is crying about a $100-300 a year insurance policy to protect themselves and others.

It's not the answer to save every life out there, but combined with proper survival equipment, proper training, reading and understanding the warnings whether it be CAC bulletins or what you physically see when sledding and a host of other factors including the not so ' common sense ' it reduces the risks invovled significantly. Everything we do has a risk factor and some are going to die.

Say what you want, but I'm guessing that if you think having insurance, registration and a license are hindering safety, your probably the same type of person who thinks drinking and driving or riding is OK, and probably think wearing a helmet isn't cool too!!!!!

 

[Polarblu]

Excuse me!!?? At whom did I point fingers? What's juvenile about posting government issued, publicly accessible information.

If for a moment you thought less of yourself and looked at the topic of discussion you would relaize that the media is playing up the costs for this S&R of recent. My intent was only to show that the costs for this and all other snowmobile related S&R is relatively small in comparison to others, especially considering that snowmobile S&R is included in all other ground and inland water S&R.

Having a bad day..........

When i read your posts all i see is reactive complaining. There isnt anything proactive about posting how many fishing boats were upside down in 2005. Coming up with a solution to help funding SAR would actually help our sport and get the damn reporters off our backs!!
And yes it is finger pointing, example of juvenile just like a little kid arguing with an adult saying "but but but little Billy did it twice yesterday, why am I in trouble!?"

 

[fargineyesore]

I don't understand this thinking, how can you say it doesn't do anything for safety but hinders it instead....

I'm all for licensing and insurance. It shouldn't be any different than having auto insurance and registration. What cracks me up is the whiners that can run out and buy a new sled worth $10,000 + or the more money than brains fool that spends 20 - 40,000 grand on a sled that is crying about a $100-300 a year insurance policy to protect themselves and others.

It's not the answer to save every life out there, but combined with proper survival equipment, proper training, reading and understanding the warnings whether it be CAC bulletins or what you physically see when sledding and a host of other factors including the not so ' common sense ' it reduces the risks invovled significantly. Everything we do has a risk factor and some are going to die.

Say what you want, but I'm guessing that if you think having insurance, registration and a license are hindering safety, your probably the same type of person who thinks drinking and driving or riding is OK, and probably think wearing a helmet isn't cool too!!!!!

I'm assuming (correct me if I'm wrong) that by "licensing" you mean registration? Or do you mean a license to operate a snowmobile? I agree with having insurance, but not really sure how registration is going to make it safer for anyone. You need a license to operate a boat now, but I challenged the course to get that (never had any training) and aced it. So I don't see how that really is making any difference on the water. I don't really think the "drinking and riding or driving" comment was necessary. Not really what this thread is about.

 

[coffeeboy]

Well said...most snowmobilers just need avy & survival training

 

[Polarblu]

I agree with the avy training as the trained people are what stopped last weekend incident from being far worse.

I also agree with registration "fees" if the funds generated go to saftey related programs like SAR, Avy control etc.

Who cares if sledding is one of the least taxing on the SAR program, it would show that we as sledders are doing more than our far share to help make the backcountry safer and that just might make the media STFU

 

[jasonrev]

I don't understand this thinking, how can you say it doesn't do anything for safety but hinders it instead....

I'm all for licensing and insurance. It shouldn't be any different than having auto insurance and registration. What cracks me up is the whiners that can run out and buy a new sled worth $10,000 + or the more money than brains fool that spends 20 - 40,000 grand on a sled that is crying about a $100-300 a year insurance policy to protect themselves and others.

It's not the answer to save every life out there, but combined with proper survival equipment, proper training, reading and understanding the warnings whether it be CAC bulletins or what you physically see when sledding and a host of other factors including the not so ' common sense ' it reduces the risks invovled significantly. Everything we do has a risk factor and some are going to die.

Say what you want, but I'm guessing that if you think having insurance, registration and a license are hindering safety, your probably the same type of person who thinks drinking and driving or riding is OK, and probably think wearing a helmet isn't cool too!!!!!

Just so you have your facts straight the last time I bought snowmobile insurance it was about 6-700 dollars for the season (5-6 months) not for the whole year. Also I don't drink and drive and obviously never had a dui. I also always wear my helmet when I snowmobile and atv. Me personally I would rather see snowmobilers put that 6-700 dollars towards avalanche training and avalanche gear. I see the reason and logic behind insurance but I feel it should be a personal choice if a person wants to have it or not. At one time I was a person who always had insurance but the rates where just too much too afford. If the rates here in B.C. were the 1-300 that you speak of, I would be as big of advocate as you.

 

[Summiteer]

Just so you have your facts straight the last time I bought snowmobile insurance it was about 6-700 dollars for the season (5-6 months) not for the whole year. Also I don't drink and drive and obviously never had a dui. I also always wear my helmet when I snowmobile and atv. Me personally I would rather see snowmobilers put that 6-700 dollars towards avalanche training and avalanche gear. I see the reason and logic behind insurance but I feel it should be a personal choice if a person wants to have it or not. At one time I was a person who always had insurance but the rates where just too much too afford. If the rates here in B.C. were the 1-300 that you speak of, I would be as big of advocate as you.

Insurance should be a personal choice if you can afford to pay for injuries and or damages your machine could cause to someone else should that event occur.....liability insurance should be mandatory.....

 

[CR500R]

I pay $229 a year for 2 sleds, liability, fire and theft. A small price to pay for peace of mind.
I agree an operators license doesn't mean a whole lot, but if the training/ course included avy training it would be well worth it.