Eckville Grass Drag Rules

[SLEDBUNNYRACING]

OK...glad you feel better now...
I just want to race, want the same race rules at all the races and want to have fun.
Rules need to be changed...slightly...as the market changes. But posting rules and then changing them at the event..shame onthe organizers.

The difference is Eckville is sanctioned by the SSRA, and they use ISR bull$Hit rules. Wetaskwin uses the same rules we've used in all races in BC and most of Alberta for the last 20 years. THEY WORK! ISR rules don't. The times of a 1000 cc limit to a "open" mod class are over. Turbo's, NOS, big, big, big bores are the future of racing. And if SSRA can't see that then they will ruin the little bit of racing we have left.
Ahhh, that felt good

 

[Summitric]

ok...glad you feel better now...
I just want to race, want the same race rules at all the races and want to have fun.
Rules need to be changed...slightly...as the market changes. But posting rules and then changing them at the event..shame onthe organizers.

thanks, wrabbit.... Well said. But, if the ssra doesn't catch up to what they are dooin' out here in alberta and bc, and the big turbos and big cube mountain sleds, then i think the ssra will end up hurting racing more in the long term, than anything!

 

[dumbassracing]

Hear, hear. I'm still praying for snow (which is apprently suppose to start Wed. here). Not much in the mountains yet, still quadding 6/7000 feet in Tumbler. The last week in November, going to Revelstoke, try out the new XP and the new mods to the turbo. Should be good for about a barrel of race gas, lol

 

[SLEDBUNNYRACING]

Yep...were all on the same page...well except those that make the rules.

Hear, hear. I'm still praying for snow (which is apprently suppose to start Wed. here). Not much in the mountains yet, still quadding 6/7000 feet in Tumbler. The last week in November, going to Revelstoke, try out the new XP and the new mods to the turbo. Should be good for about a barrel of race gas, lol

 

[SLEDBUNNYRACING]

You have an expensive drinking habit...lol...

The last week in November, going to Revelstoke, try out the new XP and the new mods to the turbo. Should be good for about a barrel of race gas, lol

 

[Maxceleration Racing]

I apologize if there are some hard feelings about the rules. However, the SSRA did not make up the rules or intend to "not care" about what is going on in the west as far as trends in sled mods. As an ISR affiliated organization, they follow the rules set out by the ISR and published in the ISR Annual Racing Yearbook. They really don't have a choice.

You might wonder why they would do this. It's for a couple of reasons. 1st being that the ISR is the only organization that has a consistent history of publishing rules and safety regulations. This can make it easier for an organization to obtain insurance for an event if it is sanctioned by an ISR affiliate. Unfortunately it has become the world we live in but these types of events just don't happen without millions of dollars of insurance coverage. 2nd, the ISR is the only organization with representatives from the 4 major snowmobile manufacturers having input into the rules process. There is an annual Rules Meeting in the states where affiliated organizations and manufacturers from the industry meet to discuss rule changes and some things are changed each year. One class that will be in the rules next year is the Pro Mod class that allows triples in a twin chassis and vice versa. That is a class that didn't previously exist. Is it a perfect process that can satisfy everyone? Probably not. But it is currently the best alternative when sanctioning races across the USA and Canada. Using this alternative is what allows racers from across the western provinces and northern states to attend the events. Some of the sleds that those posting here wanted to see more of (displacements over 1000 cc, turbos with no restrictions, NO2 and turbos on 2 strokes) have limited or no classification in the ISR rules and as such would jeoprodize the insurance coverage of the race.

There are two main reasons for some of these limits on sleds classifications. One is for safety. Much more power and the sport could get very out of control. The other is for cost. The classes, as old fashion as they may seem, allow sleds to be competitive without spending boatloads of money on them. Take the '97 XCR that did fairly well as an example of a low cost way to compete and have fun. The sport will die very quickly if it becomes a contest of who has the most money.

I know I am going to get bashed from several people but I would hope that most would understand what a tough job the techs at a race can have. There are about a hundred ways for people to think that tech is wrong. Too stringent, non sensible, not stringent enough, should have re-classed more sleds, should not have re-classed sleds, should not have let this or that go, should have let this or that go, etc., etc. Add to that a situation where a race host communicates out their own rules but then asks you to enforce standard rules without enough lead time and communication back and forth and I think you can see how tough it can get. Another important thing to remember is that all these people are volunteers. They are just trying to do their best to host an event, let people have some fun, and maybe raise a little money to support their club so they can groom trails and do other things to support the sport of snowmibiling in general. It is certainly not their intent to intentionaly dissappoint anyone. All those involved however are human and they are volunteers. Another thing about volunteers, they are getting harder and harder to find these days.

As a volunteer, I attempted to do the best I could and respond to everyone who called or emailed me a question before the race. Of the dozens of inquiries I recieved, there was only one that I didn't get back to because I could not make out the telephone number on my voice mail. Without preferential treatment or malice toward anyone I did the best I could to answer what I could. There were a couple of instances where there was a good question I didn't know the answer to so I made a couple of calls and then answered as I could.

I think that most people in attendance enjoyed the races and had a good time. I just watched the slide show of excellent photographs posted on this site (nice job by the way) and it looked like there was a lot of close racing and fun had by most.

I would like to thank the DT Snowriders for the obviously large amount of effort their small club put forth to hold a race. Without efforts like theirs, events like last weekend's would not exist.

I do apologize to those that may have been dissappointed but best efforts were put forward and I think the event went pretty well. I also understand that by making this post I have just painted a very large target on myself for critisism, but I just wanted to try and explain a couple of things in the hopes of spreading more understanding. I'm sure there are those that may still feel the need to vent but hopefully I have done more good than harm.

Thank you for allowing me this space in which to post this information.

Mike LaValley
Vice-President
SSRA

 

[dooryder]

i belive that open shoud be "open" run anything you want

 

[dumbassracing]

Gee, you are one of the guys I tried to contact about some of the rules for the past two months. With no response, normal for SSRA. Not saying you aren't doing your job (if it is even your job) but I have raced you and most of the SSRA members before and it has always been the same excuse. If the ISR rules cause so much commotion, then why stick with their rules when I can race all over BC without ISR rules? This includes up hill drag races and normal flat land drag races with three times the power and speed that you guys have, and still get insurance. I think it is just a fact of the "old boys club". I left you two to three messages on the phone number provided on this very website, with no response. I know you are probably a very busy person, like the rest of us, but in two months, a response could have been made.
This isn't the first time I have had these discussions with someone from the SSRA and it probably won't be the last.
And as for the sport getting out of control, the old timers think its getting out of control but like any sport, change has to be made or it will die. For instance, I race the Big Dog Shootout, where just about every sled is over 1000cc or if it is not over 1000cc, it is turbo charged. And we still get insurance. Same old line, same old excuse.
If ISR rules do not want turbo charged snowmobiles, then put it in the rules, so guys don't travel 5/6/8 hours to a race to find out that they can't race or that they are going to let it go this time? Like in Eckville. A few people on this website have stated that alot was let go, where rules were posted that weren't followed. Not trying to unload on you Mike, cause I think the problem is higher up, and before your time.
You can run very fast sleds and still be safe, as long as the basic safety procautions are met. It is only 500 feet, you can only go so fast. I also race asphalt, where the speeds are much faster and three times as dangerous, ie. grass compared to asphalt. We have a very strict tech to follow, NO EXCEPTIONS. And it is clearly stated in the both the IHRA & NHRA rule books. Those are the rules, that is it.
I also race pro-stock, stock, and most of the other classes with no problems, because those rules are enforced. In exception to stock cans.
Just getting in my two cents and I know I'll be complaining again. Myself and my wife would really love to race your circuit, but I will not be coming until you guys want "FAST" sleds or offer a class for "Fast" sleds.

 

[raceu4it]

nice long reply mike, kudos to you for trying, cause if anyone else here has tried to put on or organize a race they might understand, as to the rules i have always endorsed a published rule book, so long as the rules are enforced as published which is hard with very limited NOT PAID volunteers, which don't like taking heat on enforcing rules. as to racing all over BC and the bigdawg. there isn't any rules anywhere and i would like to see the hard copy of a insurance policy for an event. And YES, i have been involved in racing for a longtime on both sides of the track, and my favorite involvment was the sno-cross in calgary a few years ago which was run by the rules and yes angry words flew, and lost a few friends over it, i think they came back. and it was great up until blair morgan's team manager broke his back and is now armed powered and no races, and i think there's a little lawsuit going on now. my 2cents.
mike, once again kudos to you for trying to get the grassroots racing going again, cause it would get boring after a day of watching the deep pocket turbo stuff all day, and joe sledder and son can't even relate to, never mind compete. and before someone stabs me back, why doesn't one of the more power the better guys put on just a minimum of 1000cc turbo, meth injected all nos bottles you bolt on drag event somewhere.

 

[raceu4it]

and on a humorous note, the most expensive and limited built sled mod you can buy or should i say get or hustle up is a 90 lb wife or girlfriend who wants to race your sled. lol.

 

[SLEDBUNNYRACING]

I'd also like to thank Mike LaValley for taking the time to post an explanation from his side of the fence....so lets not make this a "bash session".

I had a great time and plan to return next year. Mike, i'd like to see your people enforce many of the safety rules such as the helmet and speed in the pits etc. Other races I've attend have looked very dimly on failure to follow these rules.

I'd also like to say that there was some bending of the rules as well. My sled failed in two areas. I did not have the clutch outer protection in place and I did not have anti-stab wheels. Both are required for my classes. It is my responsibility to read the rules and understand them...like it or not. They could have turned me and other away but they didn't.

I also ran with NOS in one class and could not have it in the other. They could have required me to completely remove my NOS bottle between races (a major pain because I was pretty much running back to back runs) but instead they allowed the tech guys to witness me purging the system. Because I ran back to back they even offered to hold up the race for some cool down time.

So in all fairness I would like to inject my positive experience along with my previous comments. I also think dumbassracing has some valid points that need to be considered.

The race ran well, very few delays, they were done ahead of schedule and we had a blast.

Next year I will be better aware of the rules and abide by them if I choose to attend this event. In turn I will push their team to have other abide as well...it's only fair.

Thanks for taking your personal time to continue the tradition of Grass Drags in Eckville.

 

[Summitric]

I appreciate your views on the races, and am glad you responded..... And i realize there is always growing pains in a new event(and basically this is a new event again, and will take a few years to hopefully get going again). But if you read the grumblings previously listed, and tried to rectify/resolve each problem over the next year, i'm sure you will have a lot happier racers and better/closer racing overall.......

I was still very disappointed that you never contacted me back in regards to the wheels and exhaust mufflers/stingers/cans, so I could've put them all back on and been really competitive then. And even the weight restrictions(with that 90 lb lady from red deer and no weight additions??), or the reed additions or drop and rolls, or vent kits all in the stock classes????...... Some of the races were quite lop sided because of this, and we could bash all day, but i guess by-gones are by-gones, and we'll know better for next year, if we attend!!!!

The races did go quite smoothly and we had a good time, other than being frustrated, and also a little peeved, at the amount of guys riding around on sleds/quads with no helmets &/or without tethercords attached. My kids kept pointing that out to me all day --- what doo you think the next generation racers are thinking and what kind of an example does that set for them..... Expecially when that was being stressed by the tech guy threatening to kick out anyone he caught without them.... Hmmmmm

i do wish their was a truly "open" class, that allowed the big cc and big turbo sleds in on the fun!!!!!!!!! Wetaskiwin does(or at least did)..........

-later!

 

[ZRrrr]

My turn.......

Mike, no apology necessary. It was what it was. You and the volunteers ran a great race overall! Like it was stated, things went farily smooth and finished well. There are some concerns as to the confusion and what some people were "getting away with". There is alwasy room for improvement and hopefully most comments here can be taken constructively to make an even better race next time. Your tech guys were great! Despite being the "bad guys" they seemed to have a sense of humour about it all. They do however need to stick to the rules they set out. No thether on, no helmet....bye bye.

I wouldn't take things here personally. Not a slight against you or the race at all. We appreciate everything everyone did to make go smoothly. I would not have been there racing without the race being on again and without your replies to my many e-mails. Maybe you can help the ISR get up to date by showing them the comments here.

As for the limits on some of the classes keeping costs down and the classes more "competetive", that's debatable. That very XCR you mention had me questioning it's performance in a couple classes. I'm sure I could have pushed the issue, but I take it for what it's worth. That's the nature of this type of racing.

Keep up the good work and hopefully the race will get bigger and better. I would really like to see more of the stock or stock improved sleds joining the races. Seemed the majority were pretty seasoned vets.

My hats off to you and all the volunteers who actually put the effort in to have a race.

Now I got to go find me a 90 lb rider for the next year.

 

[Summitric]

My turn.......

Mike, no apology necessary.

Now I got to go find me a 90 lb rider for the next year.[/QUOTE]


BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA, THAT'S IT!!!!! MY DAUGHTER RIDES ALL THE SLEDS NEXT YEAR, BUT SHE'S 125LBS........ STILL 35LB WEIGHT DIFFRENCE... LOL

 

[Maxceleration Racing]

My turn.......

As for the limits on some of the classes keeping costs down and the classes more "competetive", that's debatable. That very XCR you mention had me questioning it's performance in a couple classes. I'm sure I could have pushed the issue, but I take it for what it's worth. That's the nature of this type of racing.

I kind of wish you would have pushed the issue on the XCR. It would have put your mind at ease. I know the sled owner would have been more than open to having the sled re-teched. In fact, more than one eyebrow was raised and as a result the sled was re-weighed, fuel tested, and measured for bore and stroke, passing with flying colors on all accounts.

Another thing many may not have realized is that there was more than one 97 XCR participating in the race. They both had the same white original paint scheme and without looking real close would appear to be the same. In fact the riders even wore the same style flak jackets and had the same color and style of helmets so it would be an easy mistake to make. One raced in 600 improved and 600 pro stock as well as 700 improved (it was number 414). The other only raced in one class, 1000 cc Improved (it was number 415). I can see how seeing a white xcr run in the 600 classes and then think you see the same sled take out an M1000 would be some cause for concern. However, that isn't what happened.

Thanks to all who passed along some feedback, even if it wasn't in the most constructive fashion. It will be taken into consideration.

Mike

 

[Rucky]

I did not attend but I noticed you saying that with higher CC classes, etc... That it would not be competitive for the average guy that wants to come race his sled for the weekend or whatever. I don't really see how that's an issue... Seeing as all of the turboed, big bored etc sleds would likely be in a class of their own which an average guys sled wouldn't be competitive in to begin with. Not angry... Just bringing it up.

 

[ZRrrr]

I kind of wish you would have pushed the issue on the XCR. It would have put your mind at ease. I know the sled owner would have been more than open to having the sled re-teched. In fact, more than one eyebrow was raised and as a result the sled was re-weighed, fuel tested, and measured for bore and stroke, passing with flying colors on all accounts.

Another thing many may not have realized is that there was more than one 97 XCR participating in the race. They both had the same white original paint scheme and without looking real close would appear to be the same. In fact the riders even wore the same style flak jackets and had the same color and style of helmets so it would be an easy mistake to make. One raced in 600 improved and 600 pro stock as well as 700 improved (it was number 414). The other only raced in one class, 1000 cc Improved (it was number 415). I can see how seeing a white xcr run in the 600 classes and then think you see the same sled take out an M1000 would be some cause for concern. However, that isn't what happened.

Thanks to all who passed along some feedback, even if it wasn't in the most constructive fashion. It will be taken into consideration.

Mike

Intersting comments Mike.

Like I said, I take it for what it is and you all did a great job.

 

[ZRrrr]

I added a video in the S&M Tube of the drags. That was a pain in the a*%. I had to reduce quality, reduce size, etc. etc, etc.. Then I watch it on here and it looks like crap. Can hardly tell who's who. Did I do something wrong? Not sure how to add the link here either.

Teach me oh wise ones.

 

[Scotty]

I did not attend but I noticed you saying that with higher CC classes, etc... That it would not be competitive for the average guy that wants to come race his sled for the weekend or whatever. I don't really see how that's an issue... Seeing as all of the turboed, big bored etc sleds would likely be in a class of their own which an average guys sled wouldn't be competitive in to begin with. Not angry... Just bringing it up.

I hear yah Rucky. However, I think that these guys are saying that the "Class" deffinition "rules" may have been a bit misconstrued?

As an average guy, I would love to come and ride my "stock" sled against other stock sleds in my class, just to have fun and to compare performance with other brands.

As long as everyone is being honest... no cheating.

 

[SLEDBUNNYRACING]

So hopefully we will see you there next year Scotty.

I hear yah Rucky. However, I think that these guys are saying that the "Class" deffinition "rules" may have been a bit misconstrued?

As an average guy, I would love to come and ride my "stock" sled against other stock sleds in my class, just to have fun and to compare performance with other brands.

As long as everyone is being honest... no cheating.