anyone work for southrock on hwy 21 paving?

[boydo]

just wondering if anyone was able to relay a message....that the "new" asphalt or if it even deserves that title sucks a#$. what kind of morons would even let that be laid down for more than a day? serparation, washboard (yes washboard in two week old asphalt!!) ruts, dips, etc... this is absolute crap! If I had as many pieces of equipment as they do with my company name on it in a 10km stretch I would MAKE SURE that the job was done right. what a waste of materials and time! every truck that leaves the lights from whitemud and hwy 21 north will just destroy it! is it the trucks fault? No! its the crapass paving and basework! but who will man up and fix it proper?two years and that "new" stretch of highway will be a piece of shiat. dont believe me? look at the base contrators for starters. Aecon did a quarter of what sureway did in the same amount of time and i will bet money that you will be able to tell the difference who stopped where. a good example of a "surely" shi##y road is whitemud west from 21 to hwy 14 rough, rough and more rough. or the henday. ahhhhhrgh rant over.

 

[Mike270412]

But how do you really feel?
There's lots of shoddy construction projects out there.
Seems like they do it on purpose so they can come back and do it again in a couple years.

 

[boydo]

if thats the game so be it. but when im driving my pick up and talking to my kids and they are laughing at my voice because of the washboard... thats a little much for job security

 

[gm3d]

I sure agree! What a mess. I thought that twinning the hyway would make things better! NOT!

 

[magnet]

have you checked out 16a west of stony. what a waste of money worse now than it ever was. and they are trying to chit fix it again or something i think. a bunch of cattle could of did a better job over the course of the summer.

 

[Modman]

It's Southrock - what did you expect? They did a piss poor job south of Calgary and now are doing a piss poor job everywhere else.

Nothing new. Wouldn't hire them to pave a 6" strip 3 feet long, let alone a highway.

 

[maxwell]

just wondering if anyone was able to relay a message....that the "new" asphalt or if it even deserves that title sucks a#$. what kind of morons would even let that be laid down for more than a day? serparation, washboard (yes washboard in two week old asphalt!!) ruts, dips, etc... this is absolute crap! If I had as many pieces of equipment as they do with my company name on it in a 10km stretch I would MAKE SURE that the job was done right. what a waste of materials and time! every truck that leaves the lights from whitemud and hwy 21 north will just destroy it! is it the trucks fault? No! its the crapass paving and basework! but who will man up and fix it proper?two years and that "new" stretch of highway will be a piece of shiat. dont believe me? look at the base contrators for starters. Aecon did a quarter of what sureway did in the same amount of time and i will bet money that you will be able to tell the difference who stopped where. a good example of a "surely" shi##y road is whitemud west from 21 to hwy 14 rough, rough and more rough. or the henday. ahhhhhrgh rant over.

depending on the type of contract they may be responsible for those issues once the provinces representative comes through and inspects it.

these projects really irk me. because guess what intersection will need an overpass in 5 years when the cost has inflated 150%

i duno...maybe 21 and base? 21 and wye? 21 and the whitemud? probably all three!

i loved it when they paved only half the lane on the west side of 21 north. is that fixed now?

 

[DaveB]

depending on the type of contract they may be responsible for those issues once the provinces representative comes through and inspects it.

I've been out of the road building business for about 10yrs now, but Alberta used to pay the contracts based on "EPS" or End Product Spec. The projects are bid and usually the lowest bidder gets the contract. They hire an engineering firm to do "QC" (quality control) while they are building the road. The QC guys try to keep all the phases of road construction in spec so the contractor gets paid. Ie: testing the subgrade for compaction, testing the base course (gravel) for thickness and compaction, and testing the asphalt for thickness, compaction, gradation (sand and gravel blend), and oil content. The QC guys are busy....checking right behind the contractor so he can adjust his practices quickly to avoid penalty.

The owner (county) also hires an engineering firm to do design, contract admin, survey, and QA (quality assurance). The QA guys come by after each section of road is complete and performs tests. Payment to the contractor is based on how close the End Product is to the Specifications. Contractors are given the opportunity to make failed sections right. Often times the penalties are very severe to the point that many contractors go TU and don't get their bonds back.

 

[maxwell]

I've been out of the road building business for about 10yrs now, but Alberta used to pay the contracts based on "EPS" or End Product Spec. The projects are bid and usually the lowest bidder gets the contract. They hire an engineering firm to do "QC" (quality control) while they are building the road. The QC guys try to keep all the phases of road construction in spec so the contractor gets paid. Ie: testing the subgrade for compaction, testing the base course (gravel) for thickness and compaction, and testing the asphalt for thickness, compaction, gradation (sand and gravel blend), and oil content. The QC guys are busy....checking right behind the contractor so he can adjust his practices quickly to avoid penalty.

The owner (county) also hires an engineering firm to do design, contract admin, survey, and QA (quality assurance). The QA guys come by after each section of road is complete and performs tests. Payment to the contractor is based on how close the End Product is to the Specifications. Contractors are given the opportunity to make failed sections right. Often times the penalties are very severe to the point that many contractors go TU and don't get their bonds back.

exactly. this is a highway.there for the province is the owner.

but that is most likely how this contract is administated.

the contractor is paid on progress payments. same as a commercial building project.

all depends on the contract but every day over schedule from rework could end up being large fines the contractor must pay.

 

[boydo]

yaya everyone is checking it out bullspit! my dad used to to base gravel work years back and used to tell me tons of stories of crap that went on! if they had a soft spot park a packer or a grader on it then they inspector checks in front or behind where they know it is correct, the brown gravel truckers used to buy the foremans booze by the case! one guy my dad knew said he had 20 cases of gin in his basement after one season!!

 

[Modman]

yaya everyone is checking it out bullspit! my dad used to to base gravel work years back and used to tell me tons of stories of crap that went on! if they had a soft spot park a packer or a grader on it then they inspector checks in front or behind where they know it is correct, the brown gravel truckers used to buy the foremans booze by the case! one guy my dad knew said he had 20 cases of gin in his basement after one season!!

Yep- lots of jackets, hats, quads!!!!! and fishing trips have also been given out and magically things get avoided or overlooked.

Like DaveB said though, contract to lowest bidder, then someone has to redo the thing in 10 yrs, who cares if the contractor goes tits up on a contract, the taxpayer (you and me!!!!) have to pay twice to get the job done correctly or drive on sh!tty roads until they decide to repair it again. It's a waste of our money. do it right the first time or don't do it at all!

 

[femme.fatale.]

Crappy road construction is a problem all over the province though. I have a 15 km drive into town every morning... It got so bad, I emailed the town and the MD saying that I was afraid my bun in the oven would get shaken baby syndrome from the womb! (I know this cannot happen, but felt it reinforced my thoughts on the crappieness...)

So what did they do? Fixed a KM long section where peices of the road were literally collapsing into itself - it was dangerous to drive on, but was past my turn off - basically did me no good. Then they went through with their little pot hole fixer and fixed every fourth or fifth pot hole. So now instead of having a road riveted with pot holes, we have a highway that your vehicle rocks back and forth violently if you drive anywhere near highway speeds!

AND it's a busy road! FML... the goat road that is our turn off is a far better road than the highway.

 

[boydo]

i wonder what the cost difference is if they went with the most expensive contractor? would the job be that much better? would it hold up longer? would it be smoother? this is a risk im willin to take because as the saying goes, you can only go up from here! fawk im tired of bumpy roads! and i dont go far in a year!!

 

[maxwell]

i wonder what the cost difference is if they went with the most expensive contractor? would the job be that much better? would it hold up longer? would it be smoother? this is a risk im willin to take because as the saying goes, you can only go up from here! fawk im tired of bumpy roads! and i dont go far in a year!!

doesnt matter in a fixed price contract.

the lowest bidder STILL has to meet the specifications of the project. even if it means the contractor looses his shirt because he missed something.

this means the project will be the same quality regardless of the contractor.



that is why there is something to be said for other types of contracts that take other things into consideration like past performance and a proper proposal with qualifications of the contractor.

owners are finding out that other types of contracts although more expensive are the best alternative as far as less disputes and a betterr end product. the government will likely never realize this. and just keep patching up mistakes they catch later once its too late

 

[cybersoul]

hwy 21 isn't the only crappy job try trans canada lmfao. I'm a passed employee and know what kind of work they do. I'm proud to say that I had an awesome superintendent who took pride in his work but he too is a former employee. South Rock employs the bad and gets rid of the good so hwy travel will suck as they do more work. They just don't care it's all about the mighty dollar to them.
If your looking to express yourself write Mr. John Beck who is chairman and ceo of the Aecon Group which owns South Rock

 

[imdoo'n]

my thought has always been charge the friggin engineers who approve this crap. they get 10% of final job cost for doing absolutly friggin nothing. and it is obvious they are not doing there job.

 

[Cat Man]

I think half of it is the job they do themselves but also the weather they work in. I've seen them out in freezing weather laying down chip seal or asphalt knowing full well that it isn't going to adhere to the old stuff underneath.
Years and years ago I helped redo that highway with a company from saskatchewan and those guys would not do a thing even if there was "beer clouds" in the ski and mind you it took awhile to do a 31km stretch it sure held out. Everything is done now a days as cheap as you can get it and as fast as it can be done, worry about any unforeseen problems later if at all.

 

[Mike270412]

Used to haul asphalt years and years ago,but if I remember correctly,any government job temp had to be +5 and rising or we got shut down.

I think half of it is the job they do themselves but also the weather they work in. I've seen them out in freezing weather laying down chip seal or asphalt knowing full well that it isn't going to adhere to the old stuff underneath.
Years and years ago I helped redo that highway with a company from saskatchewan and those guys would not do a thing even if there was "beer clouds" in the ski and mind you it took awhile to do a 31km stretch it sure held out. Everything is done now a days as cheap as you can get it and as fast as it can be done, worry about any unforeseen problems later if at all.

 

[Snowdin]

Glad to see someone else not so happy with our paving projects. The twinning on highway 43 is a total joke. Frost heaves and pot holes galore. I said a long time ago the governments specs must be crap so they can save money. We never used to have highways with the kind of frost heaves that would break the tie down chains on your truck camper like there is on 43. Richest province in Canada and the ugliest roads. Arggg

 

[bryan_117]

Most slips on a asphalt highways are caused by the guys haulin that have oil leaks on there truck, the rumble patches are the same thing. Rain also causes slips and rumble strips because most of the oil layed on major jobs is a water based emulsion. The heaves after a wet year like last year are to be expected, i dont know the road you are talkin about but i'm just tryin to give a little insight into whats goin on. They will have to come back and take care of the issues, pay someone else to do it, or lose there bond.I do agree south rock is a joke, but as are most road crews, they work 15+ hour days 28 days straight and expect there guys to do a perfect job. Glad i got outta that years ago, now i just make the agg... way nicer job