Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

[Bogger]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

And at one point in time common sense prevailed. Now days companies enter into testing contracts with companies like Can-Amm, Sure-Hire etc... and the testing is written into thier HR & Safety procedures making it more difficult to counter with a 2nd opinion from a Dr. The employer is not privy to any details of the candidates condition/conditions but are only provided with a fit/unfit decision due to FOIP...

That's sucks, I had something similar two years ago. But a note from my doctor was good enough to override the companys assesment and all was good. Seem's really weird that a note from a doctor isn't good enough.

 

[lloydguy]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

From what I understand The employer knows everything pertaining to why I failed.
The person that hired me asked me to get a Doctors seal of approval,to discredit the
safety places "medical advice" on my current physical condition.
She said Management has already made a decision,but she would do what she could
to change the situation.Am I messed up in the head or are Doctors supposed to make
a diagnosis about what I may or maynot have?

 

[Bogger]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

In most cases a Nurse/therapist administers the physical exam and the results are reviewed and signed off on by a medical doctor... kinda like engineering, a tech designs the chit and a P.eng signs off on it...

The employer however should not get medically relevent details...

From what I understand The employer knows everything pertaining to why I failed.
The person that hired me asked me to get a Doctors seal of approval,to discredit the
safety places "medical advice" on my current physical condition.
She said Management has already made a decision,but she would do what she could
to change the situation.Am I messed up in the head or are Doctors supposed to make
a diagnosis about what I may or maynot have?

 

[Murminator]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

I might not go so far as the lawyer route, but I would lodge a formal complaint against the company doing the testing with Alberta Employment and possibly even these guys....

Alberta Human Rights: Pre-employment medical testing

Not sure how far you will get the 1st paragraph

In general, testing for a condition that is a physical or mental disability is allowed only where the disability would prevent an applicant or employee from carrying out the key duties of their job and the condition cannot be accommodated.

Think the 1st problem is the tester TOLD you the results that should never had happened. We also do pre-employment testing and if they fail they testing company notifies us tells us the results and if a fail and all you get from us is a "I'm sorry you did not meet our requirements" thats it there is no obligation to tell you why. We hire people that have had pre-existing injures if they are WCB it will fall under pre-existing claims and not ours. Every case is different the results we get are reviewed and determined if hireable or not

 

[lloydguy]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

Thanks for all of your input e-one.I appreciate it.
"examiner"said that the pain I have from time to time can ONLY mean that it is still an injured
area,and that is an automatic fail.No matter what the pain level is.
Doctor say's pain could mean many many different things.Even with many tests they could only guess
at best as to why it hurts a little sometimes.Something is not the EXACT way that it was before is
another thing that he said.

 

[OnlyPolaris]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

I could see this hurting you If you were trying to get a job at other company's that use the same examination company. Each employer will see the "not fit for work" in your file and may not want to hire you because of it. If its the company in town I am thinking of they are pretty rude. Had to go there for testing for a previous job and they talked to you like a pile of crap.

 

[lloydguy]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

The job wasnt here,it was west.The testing I went for in the Edmonton area.
I too concidered that more than just this employer might ever know that I was given a "fail"
I was failed without being given a physical exam or being asked to perform a physical task.
Thats is where my problem is.The "examiner" made a life changing decision(for me) just because
of a "yes" being checked in a box on a medical form.
From what I have read so far,"fitness evaluations" are allowed in Canada before a job offer has
been given to a person,but drug tests and medical exams are not.Medical info of any form cannot
be obtained from an employer untill after he hires a person. I am not quoting any specific law's
here,just summerizing what I have read through.
Just to clarify if I didnt earlier,I already was offered the job and accepted it before I went for the
drug test,and "lung evaluation"I think that is what the employer called it. I was supposed to go
straight from the pee test to the job sight.

 

[the_real_wild1]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

Where is the place you applied to? If you dont want to say here, pm me. It shouldnt matter as you didnt get the job anyways.

 

[tex78]

The other problem with this is good qualified workers don't get the job and they hire a warm an fuzzy to fill the spot that has no qualifications and does stuff wrong, hurts him self or kill someone else.

There is such a lack of workers that its sad to hear a b.s storey like this.

Just proves what the world is coming too


sent from my htc

 

[imdoo'n]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

Jeezus Bogger, you almost sound like a responsible adult Crazy!!!

don't let that crazy comment get out, they will find out eventually, but so far, his new employer is puzzled, just hasn't figured it out yet. .

 

[Trax 2 Treadz]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

I would suggest you contact the human rights commission as well and talk to them and see what they have to say. At least then you get an expert opinion on your circumstance.

Jan

 

[Murminator]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

The job wasnt here,it was west.The testing I went for in the Edmonton area.
I too concidered that more than just this employer might ever know that I was given a "fail"
I was failed without being given a physical exam or being asked to perform a physical task.
Thats is where my problem is.The "examiner" made a life changing decision(for me) just because
of a "yes" being checked in a box on a medical form.
From what I have read so far,"fitness evaluations" are allowed in Canada before a job offer has
been given to a person,but drug tests and medical exams are not.Medical info of any form cannot
be obtained from an employer untill after he hires a person. I am not quoting any specific law's
here,just summerizing what I have read through.
Just to clarify if I didnt earlier,I already was offered the job and accepted it before I went for the
drug test,and "lung evaluation"I think that is what the employer called it. I was supposed to go
straight from the pee test to the job sight.

Ok you go through all the trouble force them into hire you work you 8 hours and skid you ....didn't meet their criteria. They can skid you before 90 days they have no obligation to keep you after 90 days they have to give you severance vicious circle probably best to move on billion jobs out there

 

[Nathansharkey]

Too many lazy people have ruined it for others. Companies have to protect themselves.

 

[lloydguy]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

Ya, mur. I hear what your sayin,but it still sux.I looked at 4 other outfits that do the same thing,
and this one was the best fit for what I wanted.The more illegal things happen and the more
people ignore them ,the more it's going to turn into the norm.
That's just not right.This isnt communist china,it's Canada.We are generally speeking,not that
kind of people.
I used to think that unions were the stupidest things I had ever heard of,but after getting screwed over
afew times by crooked employers in the private sector a guy has to wonder.
This is without a doubt an awsome country,but I wish alot of things were better about it.

 

[lloydguy]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

Too many lazy people have ruined it for others. Companies have to protect themselves.

Protect themselves by violating half of the human rights Law's that have ever been written?
That doesnt wash with me.There is a HUGE difference between a "fitness test" and an employer
digging through your medical history before they hire a person.One is legal and the other isn't.
The Safety company told me on the phone yesterday that most of their"clients" (employers)
that use their services wont hire anyone with ANY injureis in the past 2 or 3 years.
So,if i break my finger dropping an engine into my sled I should leave the work force
for 2 or 3 years? C'mon.
I dont live in a glass bubble,I live in the real world.In the real world,people work hard their
whole lives,and once in awhile,they get hurt,sometimes minor sometimes not,then do you know
what they do????????????They put on a bandaid and go back to work...............

 

[imdoo'n]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

Protect themselves by violating half of the human rights Law's that have ever been written?
That doesnt wash with me.There is a HUGE difference between a "fitness test" and an employer
digging through your medical history before they hire a person.One is legal and the other isn't.
The Safety company told me on the phone yesterday that most of their"clients" (employers)
that use their services wont hire anyone with ANY injureis in the past 2 or 3 years.
So,if i break my finger dropping an engine into my sled I should leave the work force
for 2 or 3 years? C'mon.
I dont live in a glass bubble,I live in the real world.In the real world,people work hard their
whole lives,and once in awhile,they get hurt,sometimes minor sometimes not,then do you know
what they do????????????They put on a bandaid and go back to work...............

give it up, they have a policy by the looks of it, man go next door and fill out an app. murminator has given the best advice you'll ever get, this may have become you golden opportunity. look at it as such. life has just handed you a new path or y in the road.

 

[GYMBRAT]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

Had this happen years ago to me with an older ACL tear, SHE the "examiner" said I wasnt fit for my newly aquired position. So I immediately went to my Dr and he cleared me 110% BUT to no avail..........I figured FK them I wouldnt wanna wrk for a cheezy azz company like that anyways then!

 

[Nathansharkey]

Protect themselves by violating half of the human rights Law's that have ever been written?
That doesnt wash with me.There is a HUGE difference between a "fitness test" and an employer
digging through your medical history before they hire a person.One is legal and the other isn't.
The Safety company told me on the phone yesterday that most of their"clients" (employers)
that use their services wont hire anyone with ANY injureis in the past 2 or 3 years.
So,if i break my finger dropping an engine into my sled I should leave the work force
for 2 or 3 years? C'mon.
I dont live in a glass bubble,I live in the real world.In the real world,people work hard their
whole lives,and once in awhile,they get hurt,sometimes minor sometimes not,then do you know
what they do????????????They put on a bandaid and go back to work...............

I wouldn't hire you if you had a knee, neck, back, ankle, wrist or shoulder injury. There is no law that says that I have to. Too much liability. It's sad but true. Insurance rates and safety statistics are much more valuable to me than hiring a new employee. The employer has the right to ask the questions if they deem them necessary to the employees health and safety. I would not want a worker to aggravate a pre-existing injury and then suffer that liability needlessly. Not saying that you would screw any one but reality is that a lot of companies have gone under because others have.

 

[lloydguy]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

I understand some of what you are saying,during the interview process there are questions that
you are allowed to ask relating to strength and ect. if they are related to the job being applied for.
You cannot ask many other things like medical info.That is not job related.Outdoor guy's and gals
such as on this forum ,im sure have been banged up and hurt doing outdoor stuff that they like to
do.That does not make them less employable in my eyes,I dont understand the person that says they
are.You cannot fire someone after you hire them for info.you find out that has nothing to do with the
job.I am 40 I was mildly burnt in a fire when I was 13 does that make me a liability too?
Do a poll of all of the people on this site for example and find out how many of them have sprained
an ankle at some point during their life.My guess would be around 80-90% So,they are a risk to the
companies that they presently work for?Where is the line drawn?
I'm not attacking here,just asking questions that I feel are very relavent.Nathan have you EVER seen
a Doctor in your life for an injury?and if so,why are you allowed to work now?

 

[snochuk]

Re: Anyone know much about legalities for a "fitness test" prior to job placement?

I have been on both sides of the fence for the same company, craft and management. A couple false long term claims can ruin a company no matter how large the company is as the WCB rates will make their bid proposals noncompetitive....this is long term damage, up to 4 years to get rates to recover. A one day LTA has a cost of approximatly 180,000K if our rates get bumped. Have used P.I.s to bust the guilty when required as do all large companies, false claims mean that much to employers, some people just don't get it.
"Owner requirements for the fitness test requirement to access their property" is the right of the project owner, who deems the worker fit may be a point of contention. Again the few have caused grief for the masses. Craft deserve to be treated with the best care when injured and cleared for full duty irrevokably once healed. These are the "peole who build what you see around" and they deserve to be treated fairly.
That being said expect to see more fitness access testing requirements set in place by Owners to which contractors will have to abide by, presently a nonnegotiable condition on some plantsite new projects. Sorry but it is coming and will be implemented just as preaccess/post incident A&D testing was.