Another shot being fired at sledders in the press

[KatMan]

As mentioned it's not always stupid. It does happen where you hit something the wrong way and end up smacking a tree. With more riders out incidences will rise and those against the sport can easily point to the response the SAR has to do. Pretty easy to quantify, cost,, responder risk, et. We don't do something about it and take care of it ourselves(insurance or you call you pay) the easy solution for the gov will be close it down.

 

[Couch]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]"There seems to be a higher accident rate [for snowmobilers] than other user groups such as back country skiers," said Sills. "The number of participants isn' t nearly as high yet the accident rate is higher."[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]
Would love to see the facts on this one. On this side of the country the number of sledders compared to other users is far greater. Can't fix stupid for sure but you can certainly educate.
Might hurt but a lot of the article is fair - anyone of age with the $ can buy & ride the biggest sled regardless of experience / ability. Sometimes the posters on the site don't help when they encourage a new rider to get the "800" when really they should learn on something a bit more moderate. Why not go back to learning on smaller sled just like they do on the cycle rider training. Then as your skill / ability improves you move up to a bigger sled.


[/FONT]

 

[bobsledder]

As mentioned it's not always stupid. It does happen where you hit something the wrong way and end up smacking a tree. With more riders out incidences will rise and those against the sport can easily point to the response the SAR has to do. Pretty easy to quantify, cost,, responder risk, et. We don't do something about it and take care of it ourselves(insurance or you call you pay) the easy solution for the gov will be close it down.

Almost all the callouts in this area and it seems to be happening more often is to go get people that rode down into a drainage they can't get out of. They get rescued by S and R and then next day a local rider goes and drives their sleds out. If you don't know the way or it is beyond your riding skill don't do it. That is what I mean by stupid.

 

[bbtoys]

Seems like every popular groomed areas are run by sled clubs. Add another 10 bucks per sled pass per day so they can buy insurance or self insure for rescues. Higher risk areas will cost more to sled as risks are greater. Either way eventually we will/are paying for it through taxes. The government like the economic stimulus of sleds, truck, decks, hotels, food, gas, clothing, et so they will figure out a way to cut their costs and pass it on to the users. Just a matter of time as the optics of sledders never has and never will be favourable. Just plain truth. We are the smokers of the 70's, and we will be penalized till The special interest groups get their way.

oy yah, BTW. JFK's killer was behind the grassy Nole. Wake up people.

ya for sure this will never happen. if the club had to do this you would find almost all would fold their tents. already over worked and under appreciated it seems at some times.

 

[bbtoys]

hope no one needs sar this weekend as i think i am one of only a couple left in town.

 

[geo]

Lot's of threads on this subject lately.

Many hint at the capability of the new sleds as a reason but most are in denial. It is a big factor here like it or not.
Off the floor, most stock sleds will outclimb and out float the best mod from a decade ago but the best mods were built usually and driven by seasoned riders riding in familiar terrian back then. Now it's everybody, with any experience or skill level, and an easy payment plan.
False confidence in your ability inspired from the capabilities of new equipment, combined with competitive peer pressure, has led to many of the recent incidences of poor decision making, like it or not.
Who buys a 600 now? How many turbo's out there now? Next year it will be 176" x 3.25".

Anybody can get a boat licence on line and, if it is legislated, chances are anybody will be able to get a backcountry licence on line too. What is the point, other than the government covering their butt legally.

If you want to make a change in your group for safety, challenge yourself more to become a better sledder, stay away from crowds, save a lot of coin, maybe see the need to get healthy and lose weight again, get everyone in your group to cash out on the beasts of today and group buy a pack of 550 fans with 136 x 1.5 tracks and have a blast. No mods allowed.

If you don't think that would be fun then you are part of the problem and really don't know what sleddin is all about.

 

[LBZ]

^^^ awesome post!!

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[struglin]

I think this is getting blown way out of proportion! There is twice as many sleders now and avy deaths are on the decrease s&r calls are up but so is usage of the back country I bet the increase of calls is in proportion to the increase of users. Charge for s&r just like for ambulances not sure why everybody is so up in arms


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[moyiesledhead]

I think this is getting blown way out of proportion! There is twice as many sleders now and avy deaths are on the decrease s&r calls are up but so is usage of the back country I bet the increase of calls is in proportion to the increase of users. Charge for s&r just like for ambulances not sure why everybody is so up in arms

It's not so much sledders that are up in arms. It's the rest (and majority) of the people in this province, driven by the perception they have of us from what they hear and see on the news. Like it or not, they'll be the ones that push our politicians for legislation if things don't change.

 

[struglin]

The media has always been like this towards sledders this is nothing new but there's been how many threads with people ranting I wonder how many speak up and try to educate and how many just flAp on here? The government will do what they will just like the b.s. Caribou closures


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[Stompin Tom]

I think this is getting blown way out of proportion! There is twice as many sleders now and avy deaths are on the decrease s&r calls are up but so is usage of the back country I bet the increase of calls is in proportion to the increase of users. Charge for s&r just like for ambulances not sure why everybody is so up in arms


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Yup, denial is the best way to make things better. At the current rate there will be more closures and restrictions put on sledders. Keep doing what your doing if that is what you want. Your losing the war.

 

[struglin]

Yup, denial is the best way to make things better. At the current rate there will be more closures and restrictions put on sledders. Keep doing what your doing if that is what you want. Your losing the war.

Let's see the stats! And you have no idea what I'm doing my crew rides safe and is prepared for the worst and always lends a hand to fellow sledders just don't see the benefit of whining about the problems on here teach people the right way and pay it forward


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[Weirboondocking]

A few weeks back one of our instructors had slipped and blew his knee out, we were on a free ride and he was nearly stopped! We were not in a place that is easy to get out from but we did have everything we needed to get him out without doing further harm to his knee. Sure it took us a few hours to do 20 minutes worth of ridding but the thought of calling for help never crossed our minds. If it would have got to late to get out we would have spent the night and we both always say " If we have to spend the night its not are we going to make it through the night BUT how comfortable are we going to be!" Truth is the tarp under the seat, the chainsaw, the vacuum packed dry cloths..... makes a person feel like they can count on themselves to get out and we are not going to be cold if it takes us a extra night.

I can never understand how riders are out without a bag or with a 15L pack. Even when I'm showing off for a camera I leave my 30L bag full of gear on because if I can't do it with the bag then I can't do it for real!

Ask yourself every day you out if i had to stay the night can I. or if someone in my group got hurt do I have the stuff to get them out in good condition. or if I get stuck down here do I have the gear or skills to get my sled out.

sorry for the rant I just wish we all would take it upon ourselves to be responsible for ourself.

 

[Lund]

Well was out on the sled on Friday and Saturday in the Revy area, figured it be a great weekend for it and yes it was.
There were a lot of sledders out and i rode and introduce my self to a very large portion of riders this weekend.
My observation of most sledders out there was great. The majority seemed well equip and rode responsibly. I saw very little alcohol being consumed, in fact i don't really recall any other then at the parking area, just my own observation. I was looking for it. But pot was noticeable in a couple of occasion.
I believe there are a good majority of sledders that get it and are riding to better our sport through their conduct BUT i still saw the FUUKTART out there, the one that knows it all, the invincible senseless one.
I went and checked out the Airport on Boulder, the snow was heavily loaded and 3 very noticeable cornices that only a blind man would miss stood out like a sore thumb. Sure enough there were sledders pulling the chutes, or at least trying to pull the chutes. I could not believe it....BTW, i also came across 5 sledders with NO avy equipment, yet riding new if not near new sleds. AND a small group consisting of a family with 2 young children riding their own sleds with ZERO avy gear all riding avy terrain.
The work is far from done and there are lots out there that are not getting the picture.

For those on this site that don't believe the stats, do the research your self. Sledders don't rank well and lots of improvement are in order, my observation of the last 2 days was kinda proof of that.

BTW, the riders with no avy gear were not together but were different occasions while i chatted it was noticed and i questioned why.

 

[tex78]

What was there answer mike??

 

[Lund]

What was there answer mike??

It varied but all with the same final answer "i plan on getting the stuff".
I wasn't judging or preaching to anyone, all i did is approach riders and groups. Introduced my self and asked 3 simple questions about sledding. If it led to a conversation, great. If not that was ok. Every one i spoke too was very nice.

 

[Lund]

After a very brief intro of myself to random riders and groups i asked 3 simple question's and told them there is no right answer but it is the right answer for you.

1- how safe do you feel snow conditions are right now?

2- Do you think the AST program should be upgraded to only one program instead of 2 and made mandatory by law before being able to come out into the mountain's?

3- If you could get one of these 3 choices for free, which one would you choose.
a) a free day with Chris Burandt
b) a free AST course
c) a free winter wilderness survival course

Here are the average answer i got.
#1- Some really had no clue but most felt condition were very safe on Friday and Saturday on Boulder mountain, Frisby Ridge riding areas and avalanches were of little concern.

#2- Almost 50% of the people i spoke too did not know what AST stood for.

#3- A free day with Chris Burandt, got number one vote.

With this VERY VERY small survey, its hard not to see the problem.
It did lead to a few conversation's and enlighten a few while others thanked me and went on their way.

 

[snochuk]

After a very brief intro of myself to random riders and groups i asked 3 simple question's and told them there is no right answer but it is the right answer for you.

1- how safe do you feel snow conditions are right now?

2- Do you think the AST program should be upgraded to only one program instead of 2 and made mandatory by law before being able to come out into the mountain's?

3- If you could get one of these 3 choices for free, which one would you choose.
a) a free day with Chris Burandt
b) a free AST course
c) a free winter wilderness survival course

Here are the average answer i got.
#1- Some really had no clue but most felt condition were very safe on Friday and Saturday on Boulder mountain, Frisby Ridge riding areas and avalanches were of little concern.

#2- Almost 50% of the people i spoke too did not know what AST stood for.

#3- A free day with Chris Burandt, got number one vote.

With this VERY VERY small survey, its hard not to see the problem.
It did lead to a few conversation's and enlighten a few while others thanked me and went on their way.

I would say that this is pretty much what you would get in most areas.
And the response to #3 is scary - Meet CB instead of personnel safety. I would not want to ride with anyone who chose a over "b or c".

Just a big sad wow on the responses but not overly surprising.

 

[Lund]

I would say that this is pretty much what you would get in most areas.
And the response to #3 is scary - Meet CB instead of personnel safety. I would not want to ride with anyone who chose a over "b or c".

Just a big sad wow on the responses but not overly surprising.

I did this out of curiosity and it was simple. I wanted a mind frame of the general sledder out there as most i suspect are not on any public forum like S&M.
It was not a very scientific study but the results were sad indeed with such a small sample.
If i get a chance i might redo this in the Sicamous area on a busy weekend and compare. Maybe Tex will join me on this?

 

[tex78]

I did this out of curiosity and it was simple. I wanted a mind frame of the general sledder out there as most i suspect are not on any public forum like S&M.
It was not a very scientific study but the results were sad indeed with such a small sample.
If i get a chance i might redo this in the Sicamous area on a busy weekend and compare. Maybe Tex will join me on this?

Ya I forsure could do that, even tho I bet the answer would be similar, but you never know as there is so many different people out there nowadays