2019 Release Conversation

[Caper11]

2019 release dates ??

Its simple really, and I said this last year. Not new news to me.

This engine is creating a harmonic that the 800 didnt have. The simple fact that the exhaust temp sensor would not stay in, was the first thing that made me wonder if the engine had a increase in harmonics. With a longer stroke and crank it is possible.

Since I did not own one I could only speculate and theorize.

Than a couple of months went by with the release of the info on the runout. Humm I guess my theory on the harmonics in the 850 was correct. Since no one would want a heavier primary clutch, the runout on the fixed sheave is necessary to help with crankshaft life.

Why do your cars and trucks have a harmonic balancer????


BTW What skegpro posted was not from me. But I agree with what that poster said. Thanks for sharing skegpro.

 

[MK4TDI]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

I didn't see one math calculation...

Hes assuming the 850 is just a stroked 800. Does anyone have engine specs. Crank position, etc? I've never seen that around. I thought this was a completely new engine, not just longer rods installed.

It's right in the engine specs on the sleds.
Bore is the same, stroke is increased.

 

[skegpro]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

Like really, who would buy one of these thing after last season??






https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8_nRkCJx9o

Probably the same people who will buy one next year.

But if I had to bet I would say for 2019 they will silently put an updated balanced crank in and an non-wobble p drive.

2017 and 2018 owners will be on their own for the updates.

 

[arff]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

I think Cat is the last week of February

 

[skegpro]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

https://youtu.be/nJFg8UYsb88

Who rode it better?

 

[Merc63]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

That doesn't make it a "stroker"... a stoker in the performance world is taking an engine with the original crank and adding long rods to increase the stroke. This can throw off the balance as the crank was designed with counter weights for the original stroke. I'd assume brp designed a new crank for this 850, making it a completely new engine and not a stoker. Just because the bore is the same and the stroke is increased, doesn't classify it as a stroker engine.

It's right in the engine specs on the sleds.
Bore is the same, stroke is increased.

 

[skegpro]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

That doesn't make it a "stroker"... a stoker in the performance world is taking an engine with the original crank and adding long rods to increase the stroke. This can throw off the balance as the crank was designed with counter weights for the original stroke. I'd assume brp designed a new crank for this 850, making it a completely new engine and not a stoker. Just because the bore is the same and the stroke is increased, doesn't classify it as a stroker engine.

What would you call it then?

 

[Caper11]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

That doesn't make it a "stroker"... a stoker in the performance world is taking an engine with the original crank and adding long rods to increase the stroke. This can throw off the balance as the crank was designed with counter weights for the original stroke. I'd assume brp designed a new crank for this 850, making it a completely new engine and not a stoker. Just because the bore is the same and the stroke is increased, doesn't classify it as a stroker engine.

Try again. Ever hear of pin clearence???

 

[skegpro]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

https://youtu.be/Jj_lkGjgwR8

Such a beefy crank why wouldn't you just balance the crank vs using the runout on the clutch to balance?

Is there actually a scientific reason?

 

[MK4TDI]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

That doesn't make it a "stroker"... a stoker in the performance world is taking an engine with the original crank and adding long rods to increase the stroke. This can throw off the balance as the crank was designed with counter weights for the original stroke. I'd assume brp designed a new crank for this 850, making it a completely new engine and not a stoker. Just because the bore is the same and the stroke is increased, doesn't classify it as a stroker engine.

That's fair, so the guy mis-used a word based on the assumption that BRP's marketing department was correct.

Either way, they have increased the displacement by increasing the stroke, maybe they should have tried the old crank first.

 

[Merc63]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

A completely new engine. It would be called an over square engine. Lots of engines have longer strokes, diesel for example does, etc etc.

Likely the advantage of a longer stroke with a 2 stroke, the ports are in the cylinder walls vs a head on a 4 stroke, giving you more valve area potential. With a 4 stroke, the larger the bore, the more valve area you can utilize.

 

[Merc63]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

That's fair, so the guy mis-used a word based on the assumption that BRP's marketing department was correct.

Either way, they have increased the displacement by increasing the stroke, maybe they should have tried the old crank first.

Im not sure why they did what they did. Maybe they encountered some vibrations and tried to take it out with the clutch, who knows. From his argument, I gathered he was implying they took the 800 and simply added stroke to it. I think there's a bit more to the story.

 

[Merc63]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

Try again. Ever hear of pin clearence???

Explain further?

 

[Merc63]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

Sorry I wrote rods, I meant crank, to increase stroke. What I'm trying to say, is I think the 850 is a new engine design, not just stroked version of the 800.

 

[LBZ]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

My guess for not wanting to balance the crank with a dampner would be it would add weight to the rotating assembly which would reduce how fast the engine revs up.

This was one of the key attributes the new engine was advertised as being capable of and probably was a big deal to the brp team. A faster reving engine is something many involved in engine building and development try to achieve to get an engine into it's optimal powerband faster, reducing lag making it more responsive, while producing more usable hp at the same time.

A great idea, but obviously it needs more refinement in this application.

 

[Merc63]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

That makes sense to me LBZ, it does spool quick. Why not increase the bore if vibrations were bad?

 

[Eldereldo]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

That makes sense to me LBZ, it does spool quick. Why not increase the bore if vibrations were bad?

Because they were trying to keep it as narrow as possible so they could centralize the weight better. There is a good article in the latest snowest issue about the new 600 where they were mentioning that one of the design issues for it, was making sure it would fit the new 850 chassis, and that they had to go to great lengths to get it narrow enough to fit in the same space as the 850.

 

[skegpro]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

https://youtu.be/pASvNm-YFwc

I was pretty moist when I watched this back in 16.

 

[gunner3006]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

Is the 850 a true 165 stock hp engine? There must be some un-biased dyno numbers out by now that are accurate.

 

[NoBrakes!]

Re: 2019 release dates ??

Took 3 posts to turn into an 850 thread lol. That's gotta say something