Supertorquer / Heel Clicker

[06 Dragon]

Anyone out there running these on their mountain machines? I purchased the steam roller set up for the primary and the HCX secondary for a 07 xrs. Just wondering if anyone has had good luck with them? Or would a person be better of with DJ's kit in the primary and still use the HCX secondary?

 

[DaveB]

90% of DJ's kit is his custom ground secondary helix. What he runs in the primary is no secret.

The Supertorquer guys have been around for a while and seem to always have excellent products "in theory". They fall very short when it comes to customer support and set-up support. I ran a Heel-X secondary in 05. It was OK, but no better than a Team secondary and Team had a bunch of helix's and springs....plus some customer support. Seems to me the RER "catches" on the Heel-X missed quite often which resulted in the clutch flying open and the sled going nowhere...
I also ran the original Heelclicker TRA conversion set-up in 2002 on my 01 Summit. Again...worked well, but no support. I ended up being one of the only guys who seemed to get it to work. I used to get calls from Supertorquer customers all over the USA looking for help on these things as they saved my number and passed it on to THEIR customers for help. No thanks. Not again.

 

[drop the hammer]

I ran a DJ kit in my 2007 XRS 159 and it was spot on. Loved every minute of it.

 

[DaveB]

Good point. I guess I should have elaborated on the fact that DJ's kits rock! I got off on a tangent about Supertorquer there....I guess what I was getting at was that buying DJ's kit just for the primary components is not worth it.....but the whole kit works great together.

 

[Dynamo^Joe]

My clutch kit is a great enhancement for only $255 USD ($275 CAD)

Comes with primary spring, pin kit and helix.
Calibration sheet.
Support after the sale.
Technical info website.
Clutch coaching/advice.
Works well with 413, 414, 415, 440, 441, and newest DJ Mountain ramps. For certain big bore applications, I will/can grind you a set of custom ramps.

* Stabilizes fluctuating rpms.
* (Quick backshift burst) Rpms quicker to recover when cycling the throttle under heavy load at low track speeds
* 1 clicker change per 3000' elevation increase (example - clicker 4 from 5000'~8000', change to clicker 5 for 8000'~11000'
* Cooler system temperatures (from reduced rpm fluctuation).
* Slows belt wear (from reduced rpm fluctuation)
* Higher track mph.
* Harder track speed staying power.
* Strong engine braking
* Tighter connection between throttle thumb tip and the ground.
* Superb throttle control for sidehilling, stump jumping.
* Poke higher without track poaching.
* Works great with stock gearing
* Accepts gearing changes down to 19:47 (rev) with little flyweight calibration
* Increased mileage
* Uses stock belt [recommend the 377 as the best belt]

Easy to tune, little fuss.
Marries great with any engine or exhaust mod whether be head/big bore/pipe/pipes...etc.

Guarantee to work as advertised if your clutch mechanical's and engine fitness/management are in great shape.

 

[mountainhunter]

i am running a supertorquer steam roller in my 09 163 summit and it works very well,as dave b says you are on your own for the tuning,, with little real advise from the manufacturer .that being said if you take your sled out for a day with your clutch tools in hand there are some real gains to be had with Randy"s kit.i had to dig up some old pin weights from one of DJs kits to get it where i wanted it.my sons sled runs a DJ kit and it works good as well, the one thing with i like better about the heelclicker is less final force on the primary spring.but that is personel preferance..my own idea is that the secondary is working just fine bone stock, primary needs a little help though

 

[Dynamo^Joe]

the one thing with i like better about the heelclicker is less final force on the primary spring.but that is personel preferance..

Hello, I am curious on this comment "like....less final force on the primary spring"
What is your view to explain this certain preference.

Ermmm....not trying to single you out here, rather your comments are helping me out with some of the contents in the clutch tuning book I am writing.

 

[mountainhunter]

to explain a bit my sons sled is a 04 summit 151 so it would not be the same as the 09 . it also has a rkt 827 bb fully ported engine.brp roller secondary, 19/47 gears.solid pins ,when we got the motor work done we just added extra weight to the stock clutching and had some serious rpm bounce climbing in most climbing conditions.so i got one of DJs kits and put it in and that sorted out the bounce. and for the most part this setup works great. so last year we put a new primary on and put joes kit on and away we go. my 09 was very late arriving so i rode it stock for awhile ,lots of belt dust/ crappy backshift etc. riding side by side in about 2 ft of powder with the 04 he could pull away when ever he felt like it ,the 09 would out climb but more to do with the track.with the steam roller i am ahead every where but right off the line and right wide open down the field . his sled will pull close to 160 km/h on the road ,i know that sounds high and that is on the speedo but that is what it is.. i think a weaker spring and a little less pin weight could be a more efficient setup allowing the clutch to shift a little easier but still loading the engine. the weights vs. the primary spring a continuing battle right? he has more power, shorter track, should be a wash right ,? one other thing i really like about the steam roller is the ability to change the position of the weight on the arm and while that is nothing new where it is going is .. cheers

 

[Dynamo^Joe]

https://www.mxzx-revzone.com/article/top-speed-calculation-133.asp

I do believe that 827 runs about 8400 rpms.
19:47 @ 8400 = 81.2mph @ 1:1 and 97mph full shift overdrive.

If at stock clutching and 7850 rpms with "x" grams flyweight, then add an 827 that revs higher rpms, you would have either have to leave flyweight as it was or actually reduce flyweight or take the stock primary spring and raise the final force so say going from a xxx/260 to a xxx/320 (as an example)

In the final analysis, don't look at more hp equates more flyweight. The consideration is "what new rpms now" and to achieve higher rpms is either reduce flyweight or increase clicker ramp angle or increase final force of primary spring or lower helix angle - all of these details are "stalling the upshift" making the upshift less aggressive allowing the engine to rev higher at the correct new-rated rpms.

mountainhunter writes) with the steam roller i am ahead every where but right off the line and right wide open down the field
Joe writes) explain this. he can take you off the start and in an open field (fairly flat) but when in actual hill you end up passing him?

mountainhunter writes) i think a weaker spring...
Joe writes) Which force should be weaker? start force 160/xxx or final force xxx/320 (as an example)
Where would you like to see his sled pull harder?...what track speed range?

mountainhunter writes) he has more power, shorter track, should be a wash right
Joe writes) it would be nice to know if there actually is "more power"

 

[mountainhunter]

Joey your getting past my pay grade in the clutching biz ,but here goes. the uphill drag is almost the same as the field,we have tried both many times father /son thing i guess. he will kick my butt off the line every time to about 150 ft.. i am starting to catch him before that ,but that is where i start to leave him.then at wide open probably some where around the 140 km/h he starts catchup and pull away.in the mtns. the start is the same but he never does pass again on the top ..this 827 is no slouch and will run with a 09 m1000 anywhere in the flats. my 09 will trade marks or mark the same sled on any mtn pulls.and not just one crappy running one, all 162s and pretty decent riders.the gain wth the super torquer was about between 8 and 10 mp/h.same hill ,same day ,same rider,stock vs supertorquer.. and no i am not getting my clicks and miles mixed together. 04=kph... 09=mph.
now the hard part , inital force on the main spring = perfect ,final force maybe to strong and not letting the primary go to full shift soon enough .or maybe [here we go] the angle on the helix should be reversed